Here I am, trying to catch up with all the replies to my post about Ancestors and related issues. I won't quote everything or reply to everything, but please be assured that I still appreciate everything you people wrote, and all the stories you shared! I'll also split up my reply into several posts, so this won't be a huge block of text all at once.
Bat Chicken said:
Through their own mythology, it is clear that the Celts were not 'indiginous' to the British Isles, or even Europe but they strove to make it their own. The distinctness of culture today is taking a beating with globalization, so I don't think you are unique in your feelings! The question is how do we define ourselves now? What do we take, what do we leave behind?
Thank you for your thoughts! I'd have been surprised if I had been the only one who wonders about such things. It's just that it doesn't seem to be an issue for my friends here - at least we don't talk about it.
In fact, if we go back far enough, I don't think there is anyone currently alive whose Ancestors have not migrated at one point. It doesn't even take the crossing of national borders (which haven't existed for
that long anyway, if you look at the large picture, nor have they been stable throughout time) to experience a cultural change. For example, my mother grew up in the south of Germany and moved to a different part of Germany when she married my father. I'm sure that it also was a change of culture (and landscape/weather!) for her. It's the same with me: I have moved further north than the place I grew up in. Something drew me there, and the landscape is part of that (as little as I see of it in my everyday life - but here we have seagulls in the city, which we didn't have in my childhood town, so I do notice it).
I also keep thinking of the earlier Greenwood-inspired discussion we had about the different Spirits of the Land We Live On and our ability or inability to relate to them and/or work with them (the respective posts are linked
here. Now I'm thinking that maybe my current issue is less with my blood Ancestors and has more to do with my lack of a connection to the Spirits of the Land I live on (and obviously felt drawn to, or I wouldn't have moved here).
Bat Chicken said:
I think to a certain degree, it is also a longing for the past. We think of our ancestors as having more 'certainty', spiritually. Their lives were shorter, they had many more hardships. The more we strive for certainty physically in this century, the more elusive it is spiritually.
I believe you're right here: a lot of it is a longing for a past that seemed less confusing, not just spiritually. You knew who you were from the family you were born into. You didn't have a staggering amount of potential paths your life could take. There was much less social or physical mobility (compared to now), and I think people spent a lot less time wondering about who they were. I can see how that must have made some things a lot easier. Then again, it must have been much harder to do things differently, and there must have been much more pressure to conform. I mean, if my 'world' often feels restrictive to me
now, I can't even imagine how unhappy I would have been if I had ended up in circumstances that were much more restrictive and unflexible than the ones I was born into (and currently live in).
So I guess the simplicity, clarity, and security also came with a price...
Bat Chicken said:
People are very territorial by nature and it is difficult to 'break in' to a tradition. In the end, the assembly of bits and piece through a desire for spiritual resonance with or without blood needs to come from inside. No tradition was always a tradition. Someone had to start it because it filled the needs of their people at the time.
As I'm reading this, I'm surprised by how difficult it is for me to get this when it comes to spirituality, when I have no problem at all understanding (and practicing!) this when it comes to all sorts of culture and human interaction. What makes me think I need any 'original' tradition? And what makes me think something like that even exists in the first place? I get it with music, and clothes, and literature, and relationship models, and sexuality, and whatever else - why do I think it's any different when it comes to spirituality?
In fact, I can answer a part of that question myself rightaway. I don't want to be someone who appropriates someone else's culture without a thorough understanding of what I'm taking/borrowing/quoting/sampling and what its meaning is in its 'original' context. I've had that happen with parts of what I consider 'my' culture (i.e. Western queer culture), so I have an idea of how bad it feels, especially when the 'power gaps' between the taker and the source are much bigger. I don't want to be like this.
Then again, most cultures have developed from taking things from each other, or giving things to each other, and not all of those givings/takings have been violent ones (think of trading...). I'm also a huge fan of combining things from different sources to make something new (examples could be music sampling or cover versions, collage art, parodies of literary styles/genres, fan fiction, patchwork sewing, etc.), so I'm totally NOT against mixing and matching in general. It's just that it becomes a tricky issue when power relations come into play, and I find myself on the side of the (historically) powerful ones (compared to the source of things I'd like to use). I don't think this will ever completely cease to be an issue for me, and I find it valuable to reflect on my own actions like that, but I still hope I can get better at knowing when I need to worry and when I don't.
Bat Chicken said:
No laughing here, only admiration for your courage in sharing this. It is good to know I am not alone too!
EDIT: Wanted to add some *HUGS*!
Thank you for calling me courageous, and also for the hugs! I don't feel very courageous myself, though, just in need of talking about this with people who might understand and maybe reply something useful (which has happened, and I'm very grateful to have a place like this where I can find people like you).