Reading Sibilla cards.

wooden-eye

2014, the year in which I make a Sibilla deck, an oracle in the Italian tradition.
I have found some good card meanings, but they are a little brief.
As a non-playing card reader, I have no concept of how the images relate to their cards and feel I must understand this prior to creating my own images.
I will be a big project and I have much to learn before even setting out.
To my untrained eye, the list of card meanings and the suits to which they belong seem strange and disparate, so different from the patterns and numbers of the tarot.
Does any one use a Sibilla?
Another important question is....how on Earth do you read with them? Like the Lenomand or
another way. Which is the most accepted method? This will make a huge difference to how much creative license I grant myself.
Any help would be amazing, and will receive full credit in the LWB. I am most serious about this project. I made a tarot, Bonefire, it is listed here, the Sibilla, though utterly different, will likely take a similarly bold approach to the subject matter.
Thanks Guys.
 

BrightEye

I own several Sibilla decks without the playing card insets. I read them like Lenormands in combination. Do you need the playing card references? You could just study and compare the images of various available decks and work with that.
 

wooden-eye

Thanks for the reply Brighteye.
So there are Sibillas without the playing cards. This is all very new to me. I waiting to get my hands on an actual deck, I have one on order.
I am interested that you read like a Lenormand, as the card meanings I found are written as sentences, not so much key-word based.
Many of the scenes in the cards seem rather complex, compared to the Lenormand, causing them to invite interpretation, by the reader and in turn, further interpretation by an artist who might chose to make a deck.
Are these visual complexities simply irrelevant if the cards are read in combination, in the Lenormand tradition?
I probably can find out these answers by studying plenty of Sibillas, thought decent pictures in the Internet have so far proved to be I rather short supply.

I wonder, can any one tell me if the Sibilla card meanings are indeed the same as the playing card meanings as I imagine if that were the case, one might read the cards as one does playing cards?
Or not?
Are the 52 Sibilla cards a beautified deck of playing cards? Or something quite different?

As an artist I would love the option to interpret the cards quite freely, as one may, when making a tarot and still remain firmly within the boundaries of tarot.
An example would be, from my tarot; The Chariot. I replaced the sphinx's with dogs. The overall meaning of the card was not especially altered, unless the reader was set on the meaning of the sphinx as key to the card.
This kind of substitution would obviously not be the go for a Lenormand deck.
So....How rigid are the elements within the cards of the Sibilla cards?
may I learn the meanings and reinterpret?
Or..for example, should the people of the deck always face in a certain direction?

Sorry if this seems a lot of questions, I just want to know what I am making before I make it.
Any help at all means I know more than I do at this moment and is sooo welcome.
 

BodhiSeed

I think there may be two traditions of reading with the Sibilla - an Italian way and a French way - if I'm not mistaken. Drove me crazy when I first started reading with them because I didn't understand why one card from one deck would be given a certain keyword, but the same card from a different deck would be different. (Just a heads-up in case you run into the same thing). Of course now I just read it however the hell I want to.:p
 

wooden-eye

BodhiSeed
I came across this kind of thing within the first searches I made. I forget the details, though I noted them down. I actually ended up with, three surplus meanings when trying to compare two decks. I also got the same meaning assigned to two different cards.
So please tell me what is the French tradition of reading?
What is the Italian tradition of reading?

Please be as brief as you like.
I am particularly interested in the Italian as I believe, at this point, that is the deck I will be making.
Just what do Italians do with their Sibillas?

Thank you
 

BodhiSeed

I am a complete newbie at this, as I generally read both Lenormands or Sibillas as an oracle instead of in a traditional way. Believe me, I'm the last person you should ask!:D If I were you, I might email the lady whose website I sent you earlier. Since the website is in Italian, I would guess she might have some answers or might direct you to someone who does. I'm sure she could do Google translate if you wrote in English. This is her email address listed on her site: info@itarocchidigabriella.it
 

canid

I posted this years ago, took me a while to compile -

Spades=Swords
Hearts=Cups
Diamonds=Pentacles
Clubs=Wands

Wedding-Imeneo-Ace of Wands-Marriage, corporate merger, attractive investments, dangerous passions, conditions for work success, be less pessimistic, transitional sexual problems, fulfillment of an important plan, important events, pacts & agreements
Haughtiness-Superbia-2 of Wands-Pride, vanity, success, triumph, presumption, facilitated meetings with foreign persons, international relations, inclination for languages, heath is better if you stay/plan on living abroad, prepare for a change in your life
Journey-Viaggio-3 of Wands-Long vacations, return from a transfer, advancement in a position, return of an old love or friend, concentrate on a program you have discarded, relax in your home with family, pleasant weekend at home of friends outside the city, change, movement, progress, in motion, a shift, job/love move, an emergency situation, travel, voyage
Friend-Amica-4 of Wands-Close relatives, moral support, a woman right for your life, a precious friend, company in expansion or studies & research satisfactory, trust the counsel of a friend, relax, a meeting will make you happy for life
Fortune-Fortuna-5 of Wands-Publicity, notoriety, winnings, you have closed a situation, you are lucky, an extraordinary opportunity & open doors, between ups & downs healthwise but you will pass a tiring test, a win of a totally unhoped for legal cause, lucky turn, positive outcome, good luck
Surprise-Sopresa-6 of Wands-Surprise, moral & material satisfaction, wealth, repeating a love situation unsuitable for you, a little risk at work will give considerable gains, listen to health tips but the decision is yours, recuperate an old debt, easy financial gain, unexpected money; lottery or gift, indirect money. Luck being manifested. Positive resolution, deserved victory, more than was hoped for
Consolation-Consolazione-7 of Wands-Money, honors & awards, efforts rewarded, you will get the person you are interested in romantically, plans are ambitious & feasible with work, your star is good for study & reading, concentrate on a winning combination, great & good change coming, reward of effort & hard work. MOST favorable card in the deck regarding finances, abundance. Positive attitude, persistence & tenacity pay off.
Reunion-Riunione-8 of Wands-Meeting, appointment, positive place, a great passion springs up at a party with friends, neglecting work duties for too many pleasures, dedicate yourself to some evenings of rest without thinking, risk of involvement with illegal issues, reconciliations, peaceful settlement, unexpected & rapid solutions, EXTREMELY positive card
Cheerfulness-Allegria-9 of Wands-Leisure & lack of restraint, you might destroy a marriage or long friendship, you will be able to recover from a tiring period, please diet, you will finally get justice
Frivolity-Leggerezza-10 of Wands-Lightness, not serious, freedom from heaviness, inexperience, superficiality, possible unscheduled pregnancy, too many evasions distract you from your commitments, you are not a prisoner of your thoughts, unexpected risk of punishment or fines
Service-Servizio-Knight of Wands-Ambiguity, situation is not clear, an advisor, collaborator, assistant, close friend, general servant, weak in character, subdued, feeling impotent, frustrations, don’t settle for what you do-times will be better, a flash of lightning could thaw the heart
Young woman-Giovine-Queen of Wands-Precarious company, daughter, fiance, you will achieve the interest of a girl you are attracted to in time, stand aside from unpleasantness, return to a balance from ups & downs, you will succeed in seizing the aspirations of an expected occasion
Doctor-Dottore-King of Wands-Doctor, therapist of the soul, legalist, a psychologist will salvage a marriage in crisis, the place of work or school is safe, the opinion of a specialist will be reassuring, depart from the inconvenience which you did not want to find, aid from the outside just in the nick of time during a period of great difficulty
Conversation-Conversazione-Ace of Cups-Meeting with family members or friends, love fortuitous, increase in capital or work-scholarship, transitional indisposition healthwise, collective winnings to the game, abundance & festivities, very positive for economic well-being
House-Casa-2 of Cups-Building, hearth, place of work or holiday, you will know in the home of friends a man/woman important to you, change of work, career or study, a change of air will be of maximum benefit to your health, the house you’ve dreamed of arrives, your environment & members of family, a project
Waiting-Attesa,Belvedere-’A beautiful sight’, ‘lookout’-3 of Cups-Persons or communications from abroad, it’s better to forget the love person in question, it takes patience & commitment at work to achieve your objective, don’t settle, you are not pessimistic, persons or news from abroad are lagging behind
Love-Amore-4 of Cups-Flash of lightning, contract, desire of a child, you will see your son, you are ready to begin self-employment or pass an exam, the journey that you propose healthwise regenerates, you decide to take a holiday not planned, passion, excessive involvement, feelings, emotions & relationships, cupid ready to shoot the arrow, new calm, new stability
Joyfulness-Allegrezza-’Joy to the heart’-5 of Cups-Celebration, special offers, thoughtlessness, you will know the person you become interested in, apply yourself at work with more maturity to your commitments, lead a life less disordered!, accept the invitations of friends. Help arrives. Having a good time. Pleasure from an entertainment function with joy & laughter
Money-Denari-6 of Cups-Financial success connected to the past, money will be available soon, savings, avarice, fruitful union, risk of separation/divorce, risky operations at work. Must study to obtain. Try to walk & treat the illness. Don’t make plans for winning on the unexpected game.
Scholar-Letterato-7 of Cups- Cultured person, scientist, creative, position affirmed, arrival of a man in the life of a woman, entrust your job to an industry expert, the intervention of a medical expert resolves one of your dilemmas, you will receive a call that will be a great help
Hope-Speranza-8 of Cups-Period of hope, end of anxiety & stress, stability, balance & wishes coming true. Don’t give up, the positive outcome to your desires. Easily fooled, frequent journeys, exciting infatuations of youth, undertaking activities or studies without conviction. Pessimism or exaltation out of place at work, postponement of a short trip
Faithfulness-La Fedelta-9 of Cups-Friendships & lasting love, rustic environment, an activity is connected for the best & abscences from studies will be recovered. State of convalescence, the period of stress from work ends
Constance-La Costanza-10 of Cups-Achievement of objectives, meeting in travel with a woman, work envisages a transfer of place, healthwise, be active, small winnings in the game constant. Everything stays the same. Usually positive, but if you’re worried about a negative situation it will also stay the same
Lover-Amante (man)-Knight of Cups-Literal meaning or need to draw on masculine energy. Need clear thinking & positive action. Love for brother, friend, inclinations for the arts. A lover thinks of you from afar. The right choice will lead to a long career. An Iron constitution with health, a call for your performance will delight
Sweetheart-Amante (woman)-Queen of Cups-Lover, entrepreneur, shareholder, perfect union of intent, love & interest. A woman capable in trade & finance. Thermal cures are indicated. Unexpected occasion to travel with rucksack. Woman who is loved in her circle. Kind, generous, loving & kind young woman
Lord-Gran Signore-King of Cups-Protective father, pretending maturity, rich man in love. Your luck will be good at work or decide on a transfer. It is good to rest or sleep more. Possible economic aid from a distant relative. Valiant gladiator. Great news & better circumstances
Room-Stanza-Ace of Pentacles-Sex services, charity associations, great understanding of sexual love. Work shall swell sails, you can enjoy any freedom healthwise. It’s time to make unexpected choices in your life. Home, family, intimacy, privacy. Great financial news, negotiations
Letter-Lettera-2 of Pentacles-Private communications arrive, telephone calls. A jealous person annoys for attention, do not trust professional secrets or study plans, prevent mental-physical tiredness. A friend has lost in the stock exchange or game. Help them. Secret. News on the way, letter or email. Rush to make decisions
Gift-Dono ‘Precious stone present’-3 of Pentacles-Announcing changes, particularly legacy, gift. Overcoming obstacles to success, exchange of gifts. Gifts from a man. Pay attention to envy, treat the ailment, you will receive a gift that you never could allow in your life
Falseness-Falsita-4 of Pentacles-Misleading information, more than meets the eye, beware, be cautious. Envious deceit, lying, subject of gossip. Malice, obstacles, mysterious misleading circumstances. Illusory situations, difficulties in relationships, likely separation or change of friendship, rupture of a contract. Tests repeat, lead a life more serene & healthy, there is yet to wait for your project to be certain
Melancholy-Malinconia-5 of Pentacles-Suffering for a love not exchanged, the future in work becomes difficult, strive for more. You will be better even if you sleep too much, small winnings
Thought-Pensiero-6 of Pentacles-Thinking process, planning, meditating, daydreaming, talent, introversion. Great celebration for a union between famous personalities, jump in career, pass an examination with praise. Pleasure & festive work meetings encourage. You will be invited to an important ceremony.
Child-Bambino-7 of Pentacles-Small son, naivety, new life, love exchanged, guaranteed success, your hopes will come together in anticipation, bright future prospects, looking after someone less fortunate
Servant-Domestica- 8 of Pentacles-Essential luxuries, trade, craft activities, kind person, generous & helpful. Opportunity to be grasped, rewarding outcome, skills will benefit others, recognition after hard battle, fruitful meetings, an opportunity to meet love, happy union. Commitment at work & a bit of luck are your strength. Accept an invitation, you will receive a gift
Pleasure Seekers-Gaudenti-Deliranti-The delirious-9 of Pentacles-Exaltation, individual, extremism. Do not anticipate the results in love, you might ruin everything, do not pretend there was more responsibility at work than there was. Greed might ruin health. Dissent, disagreement, theft, fraud. Mental confusion
Thief-Ladro-Thief-10 of Pentacles-Sneaky, subterfuge, behind your back, theft. New event, change, secret seized. Reconciliation with family, friends, clarification of misunderstandings at work & in studies. A person of discontent spoils the harmony
Messenger-Messagiere-Knight of Pentacles-Goods, correspondence of personal communications arrive, usually verbal. Do not pay attention to rumors in love. No dates at work for certainly nothing will be safe. Healthwise take things lightly so not to exhaust. An unexpected person will be found at home
Wife-Moglie-Queen of Pentacles-Mother of a family, misrepresentations of facts, jealousy. Delicate balances in love. Rivalry at work, friends & companions. Contrariness is part of life
Merchant-Mercante-King of Pentacles-Company, employer, diplomatic ability, financial man, trader, banker, someone who moves great sums of money. Review your relationship with life. Have a little patience at work. Receiving increases, bonuses or praise.
Despair-Disperazione-Ace of Swords-Tragic, critical & difficult period. Serious defamations, misfortunes, scandals, inner imbalance. Ominous news, tears, suffering. Insurmountable difficulties, obstacles to deal with, difficulties in the face of excess. Do not lose heart with work, you have to wait for a while. Advisable to relax & exercise. You have done the accounts without the host
Old Woman-Vecchia signora-2 of Swords-Female relative, kind & affectionate. Doing something the ‘old’ way. Old mentality, lonely person. The ideal situation to move away from the city. Withdraw to study or work at friends in the countryside. Spend your free time in the open air. You will find the second home you have been looking for
Widower-Vedova-3 of Swords-Nostalgia, divorce, solitude. Repair a love meeting that you had with the right person. This is a beneficial time to start work all over again. It is good to live a little while alone. An insignificant event will trouble for some time. Sad & lonely man, pining over loss. Want to retreat from the world
Malady-Ammalato-4 of Swords-Physical weakness, unrequited love, inadequate, illness, tired, emotional solitude, alone, weak, weakened situation. Disconnected, using illness as excuses. Negative well-being, stuck in a situation, something’s broken, could even be a car or bike. Appearance. A boost of good air & the best of care is suggested. Plan for a return of a sick patient.
Death-Morte-5 of Swords-Major life changing experience, transformation, evolution. A pronouncement of divorce will change your life. Exchange of activities to other responsibilities; delegate at work. Renewal of studies. Detachment of old habits will invigorate. Saying goodbye. A cycle card, endings, moving on. Something will come up that you have always appreciated
Sighs-Sospiri-6 of Swords-Pessimism, communication difficulties, watery place. You will be called to a task which is in the heart. Finish paying a debt, serenity will come. You will have what you need to buy a house. Signal of hope. Promises of change, unexpected news. Evaluate proposals carefully. Sea journeys, long awaited arrival. Patience & strength needed
Misfortune-Disgrazia-7 of Swords-Freak circumstances, unexpected, disorder, irregularity, illegality. A drastic intervention with love. Results at work are very satisfactory. You will have an unexpected way out of a situation that you did not have
Sorrow-Dispiaciere-8 of Swords-Jealousy can lose you loves & friendships. Exasperation, tears of pain. Upsetting time. Very depressed. Temporary. Under the weater. Bad news, mental confusion. Love one another more. An investment is too hasty. Bad news.
Prison-Prigione-9 of Swords-Intolerance, sacrifices, bankruptcies. Returning harmony in love. Work sacrifices will bear fruit. A period of forced rest will strengthen. An unexpected release
Soldier-Militare-10 of Swords-Physical strength & morality. Unknown destination. Professional secrecy, uniformed person. Love ‘em & leave ‘em, formal news. To suport. Physically forced. Person of the court, litigation, quarrel, return of old enemies. You will be aware of a happy love union. The work outcome of a test will be satisfactory. You will be invited to a pleasant place, you will be welcome in a club or association
Enemy-Nemico, male-Knight of Swords-Hostile situations, personal insecurities, misunderstandings. You see rivals on all fronts. Negative thinking, nasty person, harmful situation. Be alert. Surgery. Tend to suffer from imaginary sickness, relax. Reconcilliation with a friend of the heart
Enemy-Nemica-Enemy, female-Queen of Swords-Female con, enemy, cult-woman, evil. Treacherous, false, unfair competition, unfavorable situation, misunderstandings. Disturbed friendships or family peace. Credit not granted at work. Arguments make study difficult. Your imprudence will be discovered, it is advisable to avoid distractions. Credit not granted. Arguments make study difficult
Priest-Sacerdote-King of Swords-Institution, person of power, bank, authority, supreme power. Justice, law problems which require help of someone in authority, someone who has skills to resolve the issue, someone we put our faith in. Charismatic. Union between persons of high rank. Pension. Official honors, scholarship, retirement. Important communication from far away gives back serenity. Unexpected collection of awards, winnings or insurance
 

nisaba

I've been watching this thread for a little while, and as a non-sybilla reader, I still have to say something.

I think it's very, very *brave* to be planning to design a deck in a system that you have no extensive experience of using. I'm not sure I could take that leap of courage.

<bows deeply>
 

canid

I've been watching this thread for a little while, and as a non-sybilla reader, I still have to say something.

I think it's very, very *brave* to be planning to design a deck in a system that you have no extensive experience of using. I'm not sure I could take that leap of courage.

<bows deeply>

I was thinking the same thing, but I saw that part later in the game. Maybe a year won't be quite long enough to do it justice. I just saw wooden-eye's Bonefire deck & it's stunning, love the psychedelic hippie style!, but I DO think to get all the nuances of any deck, it would be very valuable to know the system inside & out. I certainly don't know Sibilla well by any stretch of the imagination but I'm getting the itch again.

Good luck to you, wooden-eye!
 

wooden-eye

Great card meanings!

Candid, thank you for these extensive card definitions, admittedly I do have a set and unsurprisingly these are slightly different, but will add further layers to my understanding.

I am not yet even about to start the deck, I have another project in which I am deeply engrossed; until then I am familiarising myself with this, for me, fresh territory. I am under no time pressure as I am currently very tied up. When I do apply myself to the Sybilla, it will be with my whole heart.
There are few greater pleasures than learning something wondrous and providing an artistic response to this learning; for me not brave, just my bliss.

I do like to plan ahead though. As I set goals and make declarations of intent, this is a big commitment, a year of my life will be absorbed. At the start of a new venture, always the Fool again.
So here I am. I still do not know how the cards are read. I have a deck, the pictures are familiar now , but all my questions remain;

Do you read the cards?
What is the system?
Which spreads are used?
Does anyone here read them?

I would love to hear from you. I would love to try read them myself; though I warn you as a tarot reader I should not give up my day job; the cards are good, but my reading can be way off.

I have much to find out before so much as sketch is made. If there is not enough information to be discovered and learned and practiced I will not be motivated to make a set of pictures which have no meaning to me. This is the reason I have no instinct to make a Lenormand; there is nothing I can add to the conversation.

Thank you for your good wishes and time.

Candid, I just noticed your other posts on these oracles. I would love to study them with you if you are getting the itch. Let me know if you are interested.