The Great Tarot Controversy

[Baccus93]

Read the post placed by ravenest at the end of this thread (well, today it is at the end ... in the future, who knows?).

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=80545

The above referenced post by ravenest is the beginning structure of where I've watched this fallacy in so many people's minds begin to develop. Because Crowley designed and described his Thoth deck (my favorite deck, btw) on New Aeonic lines, it is assumed that the interpretations are now changed as well. This is not the case as I find it. Crowley does describe the devil in different views than xtian Aeonic views - but the card still boils down to enslavement, obsessions, physical lust and so forth. Even in the Thoth deck, this is its assigned meaning. ravenest appears to be suggesting that comparing the two versions of this card would bring about different meanings in the cards. My view is that a RWS based Devil or a Thoth based Devil is still an issue of enslavement - the only difference in view is the point of view of the observer and how to respond. But here (the Devil card) and with Crowley's essays on The Hanged Man is where the controversy tends to start.

The controversy does exist - I'm stating that it exists as a misunderstanding of Crowley's work. A misunderstanding of the difference between what an interpretive meaning of the card is based on qabalistic and astrological lines compared to what Crowley wrote this should mean to those who view the world from the P.O.V. of The Book of the Law.

The Great Tarot Controversy (as I merely titled my thread) starts with the idea common among many enthusiasts of Crowley that he re-invented the Tarot and it's divinatory meanings, when in all actuality what he asserted is that Aiwass has given us a new light in which to react to these divinations. This is where I assert that this controversy begins.

(oh, I don't mean specifically with this thread that a "controversy" has begun, but that with the basic misunderstood notion that the meanings of the cards have somehow changed.)

And then there is this thread:
http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=76097

Read the second post. Fortunately, this post will always be easy to find because unlike the "last post of a thread", it will forever remain the second post unless it gets deleted.

So we see the urgings toward this great controversy I speak of. Oh, well, okay, it isn't as great a controversy as C.I.A. based conspiracies or same sex marriage, but you see it brewing I'd hope. I mean, you do see? Right?

Now look at the last post (at the time of my writing this) on the following thread:
http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=31296

Formicida here doesn't seem to stir the cauldron's bubbles in this "Great Controversy" one bit. Good golly! That's wonderful. I love this post and this thread. It goes exactly where it should and never ever once hints at the alleged "Great Controversy."

(and the more that phrase irks you, the more I think I'll keep at it. ;-))

But I keep sticking to the Thoth threads. Maybe that's the only place I've found this issue raise its useless head. I mean, it does appear that there are a lot of elitists in favor of Crowley and his initiatory-based closed-ended schools. But that's just my perception of some I have met who couldn't find initiation.

 

[firemaiden]

I do not think that Crowley's main interest in the cards was divinatory. In any case, it still holds true, that whatever the creator's intentions for a deck were, once it is out there and for sale, you are free to read with it in any way you choose. Crowley himself wrote that he wanted us to experience the tarot cards as living beings. Methinks you limit yourself too much.

 

[starrystarrynight]

Baccus,

If you are stirring the soup hoping to raise an argument from its depths, I can't see the debate from the noodles.

Again, no matter what deck you read with and find your best results with...that is likely the one you will claim to be the best.

Perhaps I am not feeling your pointy stick prodding me here.

 

[Umbrae]

Ya want controversy? I’ll give ya controversy!

If you look at the bottom right hand corner of a post, where it says # whatever, click on it. It will bring up that post and that post alone.

Copy the URL and use that instead of ‘The last post in the thread’ stuff…sheesh buddy – if yer gonna be a Dystopian Neo-Luddite…then how about getting REAL tarot deck, with direct historical links to the movement!

Like Tarot of the Tailors!

 

[firemaiden]

if yer gonna be a Dystopian Neo-Luddite…then how about getting REAL tarot deck, with direct historical links to the movement!

Like Tarot of the Tailors!

WOW!!!!! That's over-the-top-bananas phreaky WONDERFUL. Me want!

 

[Baccus93]

LOL

Thanks Umbrae. I learn something new every day!

And I like that deck as an idea. Cool.

 

[firemaiden]

I can't see the debate from the noodles.

Oh starrystarrynight, oh me oh my, that is funny. May I quote you?

 

[Knight of Wands]

There isn't a controversy.

Tarot of Prague is the best.

Better than all other decks.



(Or actually TdM, but I can't read with that yet )

 

[ZenMusic]

>"Ten of Disks" and I will tell you its divinatory meaning without having to look at a card. It means full satisfaction on the material plane.

. in that manner.. a computer can do a reading exactly like the one you'd give... .

 

[Knight of Wands]

Say out-loud "Ten of Disks" and I will tell you its divinatory meaning without having to look at a card. It means full satisfaction on the material plane. It means happy family status. It could signify an inheritance (especially if shown with the 6 and/or 9 of Disks). Say out-loud "Empress" and without knowing the deck I will think "Venus, the goddess of Art and Beauty, Demeter, hearth and home, suggesting luxury and motherly warmth. She nurtures and nourishes." And it will be accurate for every deck. And my readings will accurately apply.

Oh what a load of cods-wallop.

Anyway, you forgot for 10 of Disks the idea of being dissatisfied with your material gains, and wanting more. Having it, but it not being what you want.

The other day I had this card pulled for me, and the reader, using the imagery specific to that deck hit the situation right on the head.

Using standard, across the board meanings would not have got that.