Beginner's Reflections: Ace of Wands [Baston]

The comment made by Moongold that 'often there is no real justification for a particular view. Just preference or choice becoming accepted practice' is precisely the reason I prefer to investigate presumed correlations independently - ie, carefully look at the Tarot, and separately carefully look at astrology, numerology, Kabalah, etc... One of the consequences is that, in rarer cases, what emerges are more precise and justifiable views. Of course, these have to be discovered and rediscovered by each of us, and sometimes years pass for a tiny gem to emerge.

Of course, just because on this particular point we four agree, or four such as we, does not make the view correct... any more than numerous voices for a popular view makes that view correct.

Going to the point which Centaur asks, regarding the leaves or flames, I tend to see them (on this card more than on the corresponding Sword card), more as beams of Light, or divine radiance accompanying the gift of being able to engage and give oneself over to an activity (be it toiling the soil or other), in a sense losing oneself in the act, and thereby discovering or learning about the world in which we currently find ourselves.

...a kind of encouragement to meditative action, hyper-alertness yet self-abandonment.

I'm looking at my new Camoin-Jodo deck...and the "whatever -we are- calling -thems" are yellow, red and light blue....and the hand also has red around the wrist, light blue/dark blue on the sleeve and yellow "rays" coming off the edge of the sleeve..I like what you said, jmd, about the divine radiance...the energy...I also see as I look at them, the colors that could stand for intellect(yellow) passion(red) communication or emotion (light blue) and even the dark blue brings up "inner" work, reflection, intuition...

I also like what you said, jmd, about studying the other areas, separately....and then, perhaps, maybe after a long time, a tiny connection happens within....I know that in my life that's left, astrology is not on the horizon for in-depth study...and that's ok..nor is numerology...but I will be open to what I learn...
As I read threads here and read my literature...more and more gets added to meanings of cards....but it has to feel right to me also...just to study the "presence" of what MAY be a particular reference to an astrological, religious, alphabetical, or numerological source doesn't mean I will use that when I read. I find the exploration, the learning, the studying, interesting and challenging in and of itself...

I loved reading the little slide show that C-Jodo do on their website about elements they have "restored." I found it interesting that they noted, e.g. the L'Imperatrice et L'Empereur, form a "human" unit...in the physical world, and, as such, they look at each other....not open to the world. In contrast, they comment on La Papesse and Le Pape as a "spiritual" unit, who, as such need not be "together" in the physical world and so they can "face outward" open to the world...there was much more of interest in this show...I added it to the Camoin thread...but here it is again, in case anyone is interested...the links (38 of them) are to the left and if one watches each slide, there are visuals that help if reading the French is not an option...get past the first slide and the visual helps...:

http://camoin.com/diapo_rest_fr/iexplorer/800x600/diaporama_fichiers/frame.htm

I also ordered their reprint of the Conver 1760...it's nice to have but I wouldn't read with it...Now I see why the Ancient 1995 TdM Cover is so "tan."

Now come on you lot, I've only been gone a week and look what happens in the H&I forum...... the minute my back is turned....... I'll be back to this thread.........

M*

Moonbow* said:

Now come on you lot, I've only been gone a week and look what happens in the H&I forum...... the minute my back is turned....... I'll be back to this thread.........

M*

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Good! Isn't this great?? I feel as I read each post, new little bits of imagery and meaning get tucked inside somewhere to emerge later....when I least expect it...

t2

Jewel-ry said:

It is funny when we get these visions isn't it? Whenever I see the As de Bastons, I see it as a torch and want to see a flame coming out of the top so that it can light the way in a dark cave. Come to think of it, thats probably pretty relevant!!

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Yes, I also envision the Ace of Bastons/Wands as a torch of primal energy. A good example of this is in Robert M. Place's Alchemical Tarot, in which all the Staffs (bastons) are aflame at the top. See attached...

Re: Beginner's Reflections: Ace of Wands

Centaur said:

I also note that there appears to be a red bracelet around the wrist... so I am thinking, 'Is this a bracelet? Or is this just the clothing of the individual? And does it have any relevance?'.

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I don't know which deck you're using. The Fournier?

In the Hadar deck... (as well as the Dodal) this "bracelet" can be found on another card. For those who have this deck... good hunting!

Re: Re: Beginner's Reflections: Ace of Wands

Diana said:

In the Hadar deck... (as well as the Dodal) this "bracelet" can be found on another card.

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Would this be the Roy de Bastons? In the Hadar, there is also a red cuff or fold on the end of the right sleeves of Le Bastelevr, L'Imperatrice, Le Chariot, La Temperance, Le Ivgement, and the Vaslet D'Espees.

Strange2: I need to apologise here. My mind had strayed onto another detail and that was not the red on the "bracelet" but the sort of green ribbon that is curled around in it. I have been thinking of it a lot since this thread began.

Awfully sorry. What I meant was that the ribbon is to be found somewhere else. So my remark actually had nothing to do with Centaur's remark.

Diana said:

What I meant was that the ribbon is to be found somewhere else.

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In the Hadar, there is a blue ribbon surrounding the Angel in Le Ivgement. Is that it? There is also the blue ribbon surrounding the hand on the Ace of Swords.

punchinella wrote:
Thanks for the link Moongold. Interesting that the body part associated with this letter (on this site at least--??) just happens to be hand!

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I am undecided as to whether or not these shapes were originally intended to represent 'yuds' but I do find it interesting that they appear only on the Aces depicting hands!

In any case, these posts (as well as others on another thread) put me in mind to correct some misconceptions regarding the meaning of the 22 Hebrew letter names. Those comments can be found here:

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?s=&postid=281378#post281378

and, while those comments may not bear directly upon the Ace of Wands, I think the misconceptions are important for Tarotists to be aware of. The issue is particularly relevant to those of us interested in older, historical designs such as the Marseilles.

Thanks,

- Mark