Orion and the Penis Nebula

Hi everyone,

This is developing into a very interesting discussion about an image found in the stars. As it progresses please keep the Aeclectic Tarot Forum Rules in mind, so everyone can learn and have a fun time. In particular:

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Thanks all

Kwaw I have looked very carefully at the card you linked here-
http://association.tarotstudies.org...ers/news38.html
Orion seems to have four likely lads in four positions around and below him.
I think they are the stars on the ecliptic in the four directions around and below Orion. The are the 'Watchers' and are very good aid memoir depicted as watching his creative force in the yearly Calendar. So who do I think they are?
Between his legs I think is Aldebaran the eye of Taurus, the lad hold the Birds nest that is Pleiades that would be considered in front of Alderbaran.His Arabic name is Ad Dabaran which means Follower of Pleiades. He would be the Watcher of the East. Behind Orion's right leg is The Watcher of the West, Antares which is in Scorpius. It is a red Supergiant star, so the lad is dressed suitably in Dark red. I think his Arabic name is Al Jabhah which means something like 'big red forehead.'
I think the lad with the blue top in front of right leg is Regulus in Leo. It fluctuates in brightness, sometimes looking dark/ sometimes bright.I cannot find his Arabic name. He is bending over like the sickle part of Leo. That leaves the Lad on the right- so if he is Fomalhaut the mouth star of the Southern Fish Pisces Austrinus I can only think he is clasping the left leg of Orion to indicate he is around in front of Ras al Jathi a very red star whose name means the 'Kneeling one' in the Hercules group which is called a keystone of four stars in the Summer. Then again I might be completly wrong.... but that is a small might be as I have been astral travelling all afternoon. ~Rosanne

Rosanne said:

Kwaw I have looked very carefully at the card you linked here-
http://association.tarotstudies.org...ers/news38.html
Orion seems to have four likely lads in four positions around and below him.
I think they are the stars on the ecliptic in the four directions around and below Orion. The are the 'Watchers' and are very good aid memoir depicted as watching his creative force in the yearly Calendar. So who do I think they are?
Between his legs I think is Aldebaran the eye of Taurus, the lad hold the Birds nest that is Pleiades that would be considered in front of Alderbaran.His Arabic name is Ad Dabaran which means Follower of Pleiades. He would be the Watcher of the East. Behind Orion's right leg is The Watcher of the West, Antares which is in Scorpius. It is a red Supergiant star, so the lad is dressed suitably in Dark red. I think his Arabic name is Al Jabhah which means something like 'big red forehead.'
I think the lad with the blue top in front of right leg is Regulus in Leo. It fluctuates in brightness, sometimes looking dark/ sometimes bright.I cannot find his Arabic name. He is bending over like the sickle part of Leo. That leaves the Lad on the right- so if he is Fomalhaut the mouth star of the Southern Fish Pisces Austrinus I can only think he is clasping the left leg of Orion to indicate he is around in front of Ras al Jathi a very red star whose name means the 'Kneeling one' in the Hercules group which is called a keystone of four stars in the Summer. Then again I might be completly wrong.... but that is a small might be as I have been astral travelling all afternoon. ~Rosanne

Click to expand...

The birth of Abraham:

The fool may be considered the one seventh of the three and one sevenths required to complete the circle, for the serpent to grasp/swallow its tail, it is not a complete 'bit' but an intercalary part required to complete a cycle or synchronise two cycles. In another thread I have mentioned how we may possibly relate the Fool to the concept of the intercalary days / months required to maintain the year with the circle, or of one cycle [eg the lunar] with another [eg the seasons, solar cycle]. And how we may relate this to the 'H' inserted in the names of Abraham and Sarah following Abraham's covenant with G-d [synchronising or uniting the lesser with the greater, lower with upper, of which circumcision is the symbol or sign]. The four corner stars, it is said, were swallowed by a great star at the birth of Abraham:

ABRAHAM - THE STAR IN THE EAST
"Terah had been a high official at the court of Nimrod, and he was held in great consideration by the king and his suite. A son was born unto him whom he called Abram, because the king had raised him to an exalted place. In the night of Abraham's birth, the astrologers and the wise men of Nimrod came to the house of Terah, and ate and drank, and rejoiced with him that night. When they left the house, they lifted up their eyes toward heaven to look at the stars, and they saw, and, behold, one great star came from the east and ran athwart the heavens and swallowed up the four stars at the four corners. They all were astonished at the sight, but they understood this matter, and knew its import. They said to one another: "This only betokens that the child that hath been born unto Terah this night will grow up and be fruitful, and he will multiply and possess all the earth, he and his children forever, and he and his seed will slay great kings and inherit their lands."

From Ginsburg's The Legends of the Jews Volume I, Chap. 5.

Kwaw

That is quite fascinating- Abraham's Star is Fomalhaut. I know it portends rain, and drinks from Aquarius. Drinks like a fish? The time of Barley beer? I wonder how it ate the four corners of Hercules? The sky would have been a lot clearer then, and maybe the carousers could see the red dust around it. At any rate all I found out about Tarot just opens up another door. Thanks Kwaw.~Rosanne

As I read the image, the giant Orion in Jewish/Christian legend is identified with Nimrod, at whose court Terah, Abrahams father, was a court astrologer. At Abraham's birth a great star in east was seen that swallowed the four stars at the corners of heaven [that is to say, it encompassed the whole of heaven].

Abraham too, like his Father, worshipped the stars, but had an epiphany in which he realized that it was not the stars that were the true gods, but the one that made them, and who was beyond and encompassed [swallowed] them all. He made a covenant with the one god, and the sign of that covenant was circumcision. The word for sign is ATh [aleph tau], the tau is a mark like an 'X' and we may see the Fool and four corner stars as forming a quincunx Tau, Orion itself is attributed to Aleph, so we have encapsulated in the image the word Ath, sign. The true centre or focus of the image is not the Fool, but his genitals, where the sign of the covenant, circumcision, is made [an association thus between Orion's penis and Orions sword, as blade, that makes the cut, the mark 'X'].

Kwaw

kwaw said:

The word for sign is ATh [aleph tau], the tau is a mark like an 'X' and we may see the Fool and four corner stars as forming a quincunx Tau, Orion itself is attributed to Aleph, so we have encapsulated in the image the word Ath, sign.

Kwaw

Click to expand...

Or, another way, take a look at the Hebrew letter aleph, it is made of one long stroke of a vau, with two small jots or yuds, that is, a penis and two testes.

The central point of the 'X' is the genitals of the fool, that is Aleph; lines in four directions [to the four corner stars] forming tau 'X', aleph and tau, the first and the last, ATh, a sign; the sign of the covenant, symbol of Abrahams epiphany, of the one god that encompasses [swallows] the stars.

Kwaw

Rosanne said:

That is quite fascinating- Abraham's Star is Fomalhaut. I know it portends rain, and drinks from Aquarius. Drinks like a fish?

Click to expand...

Isn't there a fish in the star card of one deck [can't recall it at the moment].

Kwaw

firemaiden said:

Whoah... whoah whoah whoah whoah folks. Whoah.

NEVER YOU FEAR, ASTROLOGY TROLL IS HERE!!!!

Okay, seriously, it doesn't take a lot of imagination to see a penis in three points of light arranged in a line. But why stop there?

I hereby submit that those three dots are not a penis. They are the begining of a flower blooming. They are three pearls of wisdom dripping from the prophet's mouth. They are the droplets of water spinging from the winged horse's step, the first fountain... they are a virgin's sacrificial Bluttropfchen hitting the snow. They are a dipstick in a can of paint, controls to a vast spaceship, the beginning of a string of beads, a very large telephone, warthog's tail, sucking wand to the cosmic vaccuum cleaner...

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They are all those things and more, to any of us as individuals, they are dots we may picture anyway we wish. But they were pictured in certain ways by ancient cultures, as a way perhaps to teach and to remember, for very practical purposes, as locational markers, of seasons or positon, calendrical or navigational, of time and space, useful in that respect in much as they achieved status of a cultural convention, but such would all be lost with nothing to go by but our individual dipsticks Sailing on the sea there is no point saying sail with can of paint and very large telephone, the warthogs tail or vacuum cleaner on your left, if you are the only one that knows what the **** you mean Individuality is fine, until it gets your family lost at sea and drowned. Convention, however boring, has certain advantages over eccentricity in particular situations.

Kwaw

Okay, that's beautifully said, Kwaw. I never thought of it that way. Cool!