Can Tarot really foretell the Future ?

[Teheuti]

And in fact, none of that actually materialized....still, I suppose IT WAS magical and amazing her ability to read my mind....no doubt about that....but what good are a driver's " ability, speed, precision, and educated intuition " if it doesn't really lead you where you want to go ? If all it does is understand where you want to go, mirror your intentions, and possibly mislead you as a result ? Of course we are filled with awe when we are faced with someone who, through tarot, or by holding our granny's watch-I've had that as well-or simply by staring at us, is able to see all sorts of things about our lives, our wishes, and so on.

It is the awe that can lead to problems in that we think the reader then has all the answers and that their advice and predictions are accurate, too, or think that to question them is only at our own peril.

BUT SO WHAT ????

I assume you mean - "So what if a reader can see all our current thoughts and past actions if their predictions aren't accurate?" I think this is a great question! One of the best!!!

For me, current thoughts, hopes, issues of all kinds lead to values clarification. A person struggles to keep a terrible job. Why? - so that her child can attend a private school. Why? - so that she can study music. Why? - to develop her natural talents while still young. Ah, now she can explore how she can find ways for her child tp develop these natural talents while still young, independently of keeping or not keeping her job! (An even deeper level of why has to do with what makes her a good mother - but we don't necessarily have to go into that.)

I find that Tarot gets to these kinds of insights faster than any other method I know. I hope to assist people in finding the inner resources and overarching goals that help him or her "meet whatever comes in the best possible way."

However, I think each Tarot reader needs to assess their own skills and abilities and find what actually works best for them and their clients.

 

[Teheuti]

When a client says they already know what we've seen in the cards (it's not that unusual), then I ask if they realized it was the current pivotal issue - it really is what is important - or that it is key to the meaning of their current experience. I help them find the pattern in their experience/thoughts/hopes and the 'meaning' behind that pattern. But that's just what I'm good at doing and what I've found works best for most people who come to me. [See Man's Search for Meaning by Viktor Frankl.]

I believe each Tarot reader is unique and should maximize their own gifts, learning by trying out what others teach and settling eventually on what works best for them.

 

[Nikita_]

It is the awe that can lead to problems in that we think the reader then has all the answers and that their advice and predictions are accurate, too, or think that to question them is only at our own peril.


I assume you mean - "So what if a reader can see all our current thoughts and past actions if their predictions aren't accurate?" I think this is a great question! One of the best!!!

For me, current thoughts, hopes, issues of all kinds lead to values clarification.
I find that Tarot gets to these kinds of insights faster than any other method I know. I hope to assist people in finding the inner resources and overarching goals that help him or her "meet whatever comes in the best possible way."

However, I think each Tarot reader needs to assess their own skills and abilities and find what actually works best for them and their clients.

I think the awe is inevitable, when we are faced with someone who seems to be able to read us like a book...that of course doesn't mean we are allowed to lose sight of reality, but you have to admit, it comes natural, at least when you're a novice, to think that if someone is that good at seeing the past and present, it follows that they shouldn't be totally incapable of seeing the future...but then, of course, we learn otherwise....but it does seem like a nasty joke...then of course, some would say that our expectations of psychics/tarot were wrong to begin with....and they probably would be right...but seriously, where was this myth of tarot as a divination tool born, exactly ???

Yes, you assume right, that was my question...

I guess the use of tarot you indicated-assisting people-or ourselves-in their choics is the best answer...which still, leaves other important questions open....

And my other question is : how come so many brilliant psychics insist on selling their visions as future predictions ? Seriously they don't know by now that they are simply reading people's minds and thoughts ? No matter how experienced they are, they seem unaware of what they can and can't do, most of the time....

 

[Nikita_]

When a client says they already know what we've seen in the cards (it's not that unusual), then I ask if they realized it was the current pivotal issue - it really is what is important - or that it is key to the meaning of their current experience. I help them find the pattern in their experience/thoughts/hopes and the 'meaning' behind that pattern. But that's just what I'm good at doing and what I've found works best for most people who come to me. [See Man's Search for Meaning by Viktor Frankl.]

I believe each Tarot reader is unqiue and should maximize their own gifts, learning by trying out what others teach and settling eventually on what works best for them.

And you believe that there are tarot readers who are " specialized " or really brilliant at seeing the future ?

 

[ravenest]

Speaking of bugs, when camping I used to have a terrible time with mosquitos until I started talking to them. I couldn't get them to give up on me entirely, but I found over many years that if I talk to them & willingly accept their bites the first night that they leave me alone from that point on. I don't know if this involves some kind of chemical reaction but it has worked for me ever since, without fail. (Other people around me would get bitten night after night.) Sure, things work that probably can't be studied scientifically, but I don't know if this particular arrangement can work for everyone.

Ha! The earliest reference to that I read was Crowley saying you have to 'Love' the mosquitoes

The last time I heard that, it was repeated from the other room a few times, like a mantra, to be eventually followed by .... <swat!> "Bloody Mosquitoes! "

You do realise some people's chemical makeup is less attractive to them ? If a friend of mine is near me, I will never get bitten.

 

[Teheuti]

Regarding Victor Frankl's book, Man's Search for Meaning, that I mention above. Here's a summary of a section of it (link below), referring to what Frankl learned from being in a concentration camp: "The biggest source of psychological stress was of the unknown, particularly how long the imprisonment and abuse might be, as dates of relief were never provided. A man who was not able to envision the end to these circumstances was not able to aim at an ultimate goal in life. People with this mindset were often prone to unravel internally. Frankl relates this to the plight of the unemployed worker who becomes depressed with his or her condition, continuing to limit the ability to get a job." http://www.bookrags.com/studyguide-mans-search-for-meaning/

What's interesting here is that I've come across three separate instances where people in concentration camps or the ghetto during WWII, when asked what was the greatest factor that helped them survive, replied it was the fortune tellers - even when the fortune teller was wrong (kept predicting the end would be soon)! I find this a profound truth, forged in the most horrendous fire. When facing the unknown, even a lie or an inaccurate prediction can be the key to unlimiting our potential.

 

[ravenest]

And exactly how should they test them?! [emoji33]

Errrmmm ... I probably should NOT outline a lab experiment here ? If you have a real interest in it PM me.

However, what you describe comes close to a phenomenon called priming. There was an experiment: They had scientists test the intelligence of two groups of mice. In some of the cases the scientists were told one of the group had the smarter rodent-members.

Sounds more like a test on 'research bias' other than what I meant with test 1. No one should be told anything except 'These machines repel vermin', test and collate the results. Test 2 occurs after the resuts and tricks of test 1 have been communicated to the participants.

In these cases the groups which were said to be more clever achieved the better results. This had a lot to do with our perception...

This had some relevance for our topic I think but it's not what you want to point out, is it?

I was refering to the notion that 'magic' it might not ALL be 'in our heads' .

 

[Nikita_]

Regarding Victor Frankl's book, Man's Search for Meaning, that I mention above. Here's a summary of a section of it (link below), referring to what Frankl learned from being in a concentration camp: "The biggest source of psychological stress was of the unknown, particularly how long the imprisonment and abuse might be, as dates of relief were never provided. A man who was not able to envision the end to these circumstances was not able to aim at an ultimate goal in life. People with this mindset were often prone to unravel internally. Frankl relates this to the plight of the unemployed worker who becomes depressed with his or her condition, continuing to limit the ability to get a job." http://www.bookrags.com/studyguide-mans-search-for-meaning/

What's interesting here is that I've come across three separate instances where people in concentration camps or the ghetto during WWII, when asked what was the greatest factor that helped them survive, replied it was the fortune tellers - even when the fortune teller was wrong (kept predicting the end would be soon)! I find this a profound truth, forged in the most horrendous fire. When facing the unknown, even a lie or an inaccurate prediction can be the key to unlimiting our potential.

Are you actually praising the merits of self-delusion ?

 

[Teheuti]

And my other question is : how come so many brilliant psychics insist on selling their visions as future predictions ? Seriously they don't know by now that they are simply reading people's minds and thoughts ? No matter how experienced they are, they seem unaware of what they can and can't do, most of the time....

This book can answer you far better than I can: Mistakes Were Made (But Not by Me): Why We Justify Foolish Beliefs, Bad Decisions, and Hurtful Acts.
http://www.amazon.com/Mistakes-Were-Made-But-Not/dp/0156033909/

 

[ravenest]

Regarding Victor Frankl's book, Man's Search for Meaning, that I mention above. Here's a summary of a section of it (link below), referring to what Frankl learned from being in a concentration camp: "The biggest source of psychological stress was of the unknown, particularly how long the imprisonment and abuse might be, as dates of relief were never provided. A man who was not able to envision the end to these circumstances was not able to aim at an ultimate goal in life. People with this mindset were often prone to unravel internally. Frankl relates this to the plight of the unemployed worker who becomes depressed with his or her condition, continuing to limit the ability to get a job." http://www.bookrags.com/studyguide-mans-search-for-meaning/

What's interesting here is that I've come across three separate instances where people in concentration camps or the ghetto during WWII, when asked what was the greatest factor that helped them survive, replied it was the fortune tellers - even when the fortune teller was wrong (kept predicting the end would be soon)! I find this a profound truth, forged in the most horrendous fire. When facing the unknown, even a lie or an inaccurate prediction can be the key to unlimiting our potential.

My grand father learned to astral project and travel so as to be able to 'escape' his internment as a POW, thats not what he called it, but when he described how he 'just left one day' because he 'had to' and how he described those experiences ... yep! Astral projection!