How do you keep neutral

[ANA]

hi, all

i have been following this thread and wanted to have a discussion on another point that to me seemed related but still different enough to justify another thread and that i believe to also be important

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=136300

i had been reading cartomancy for years, when i started tarot i decided that a good way to learn was to go an pay for some readings and see how other people were interpreting the cards

i still do this sometimes just to see how other people interpret

what has had me angry on several ocasions was the evident personal bias of the reader, such as twisting evidentely good card combinations to suite their own view of how the issues should be and giving such obvious biased negative advice is not even worth mentioning

it had made me angry because there are not many people out there that use the tarot and so when they go to a reader they would not have the knowledge to see the bias

i have to say that reading and geting readings here on AT has been a wonderfull experience for me as there seems to be a total and complete lack of personal bias in the way the cards are interpreted

but in a face to face reading my experince has been to the opposite

how about you what are your experiences on this and how do you manage to keep your own lives out of your readings?

 

[214red]

if someone has an agenda they are letting their ego get in the way.

however you mention about good card combinations, there really are no such thing if a reader is using intuition a good combination might not feel so good to them. The cards are for the reader to interpret, not the sitter, even though you read yourself.

my question about your post is, did the readings that you have not satisfy you because you saw the cards in a different light? or was it because it didnt resonate with you?

The cards coming out in in a reading dont really matter, its the readers interpretation that matters.

I keep my bias out of the reading by reading the cards, i dont empathise, i dont give advice, i say what the cards message is. I give guidence the cards give me to pass on, i dont chip in my own ideas. I might explain something by using a situation that the sitter might understand, but thats it

 

[ANA]

if someone has an agenda they are letting their ego get in the way.

however you mention about good card combinations, there really are no such thing if a reader is using intuition a good combination might not feel so good to them. The cards are for the reader to interpret, not the sitter, even though you read yourself.

my question about your post is, did the readings that you have not satisfy you because you saw the cards in a different light? or was it because it didnt resonate with you?

The cards coming out in in a reading dont really matter, its the readers interpretation that matters.

I keep my bias out of the reading by reading the cards, i dont empathise, i dont give advice, i say what the cards message is. I give guidence the cards give me to pass on, i dont chip in my own ideas. I might explain something by using a situation that the sitter might understand, but thats it

i absolutely agree with you about the cards and no the readings were not about not resonating or becasue i would have interpreted different

i will give you an example of a reading statement that made me want to ask for my money back

"all there is here is good sex, life is more than that ..........you should gives this guy up........"

this example would not matter if the reading was from a friend that lets say knew me but from a complete stranger at a reading fair????????


yes i do agree about your statement regarding good card combinations that dont feel right to the reader, and i have had readers tell me " ok this is normaly and extraordinary combination but......."

my examples may be feeble but i hope it gives you and idea of what i mean,

 

[214red]

i will give you an example of a reading statement that made me want to ask for my money back

"all there is here is good sex, life is more than that ..........you should gives this guy up........"

maybe the phrasing is wrong for some people, and i definately think the advice at the end 'life is more than that.......you should give this guy up' is wrong as its advice and you asked for a reading. Its the readers opinion and that shouldnt come into the reading. You have every right to tell the person you wanted a reading not advice, and keep the reader on track

 

[ANA]

yes we do agree, what you said about just telling the story is what i try to do at all times when i read for strangers

when it becomes hard is when you are asked for advice

i usualy use the "what i would do is.........."

how do you give advice?

do you even give advice?

 

[214red]

yes we do agree, what you said about just telling the story is what i try to do at all times when i read for strangers

when it becomes hard is when you are asked for advice

i usualy use the "what i would do is.........."

how do you give advice?

do you even give advice?

Its a tricky area, if you dont know the person then you need to decide if you want to give the person advice. I usually state the situation, and ask if thats what they want. Usually if someone wants advice they want someone else to take the decision out of their hands, and really we cant do that as we dont live with the consequences, they need to make it

 

[Wendywu]

If someone wants advice I make sure there is a card in an "advice" position in the spread - then I read that card. What it says to me is the advice I pass on. I don't give my personal opinions or my own advice on the situation - I am the reader, not the counsellor, and my job is to read the cards.

 

[Sinduction]

I don't give advice, ever. I tell my sitter what their options are, given what the cards are telling me. And I am asked many times what I would do in their position. I simply cannot answer that because I am not in their position.

It really is about letting go of your ego. To have no stake in your sitter's choices at all. After all, we are only getting a glimpse of their life. We have no idea what path their life is supposed to take.

I've seen this same thing plenty of times, especially when a reader finds out their sitter is having an affair and then insist that their sitter ends the affair. Why? How do we know this affair isn't part of their life path? Think of the lessons to be learned in this situation! It is not for us to judge, only to relay the message in the cards. Now, if the cards were suggesting that my sitter should end the affair, I would tell them what the cards were saying.

And really, what does it matter to me what my sitter is doing? We are not counselors or therapists and we shouldn't act as such.

 

[MareSaturni]

i will give you an example of a reading statement that made me want to ask for my money back

"all there is here is good sex, life is more than that ..........you should gives this guy up........"

I would have told this reader "phew! thank goodness, all i want from him is sex anyway..."

I think it's hard to give someone a rading and keeping it completely advise-free. Many people come to us for an advice, it's somehow connected to the whole idea of getting a reading. If they knew what to do, they wouldn't need us.

But, a good advice is the one that speaks to the sitter, not necessarily to the reader. So i think it's important to forget what you think and simply read the card. Biased readings come from readers that don't get their egos out of the way while giving their clients the message.

As tarot readers, we have to constantly exercise the suspension of our own egos and opinions. They don't matter when we are reading. All that matters is the message.

Like Umbrae said once, we are a conduit. Conduids don't judge they just communicate.

 

[irisa]

To my mind, readings are of no benefit at all when used to tell someone what to do and I would not do so. Readings benefit most when they empower the sitter to think about their situation thus encouraging them to think more and make a decision that feels right for them. Not to remove them from the responsibility in a "it's all in the cards" mystical type scenario I don't see how this is helpful. It's the sitter that has the full picture.

irisa