Is Aleister Crowley an Evil Man?

sacredashes

ravenest said:
No you didnt come across like that to me, I quoted L.L. in agrrement with you :)

LOL... oh **blush** I saw all the "thou"s and it reminded me and the local priest frowning down at me when I was a kid :(. Those eyes made me want to run for cover!!

Thanks for clearing that up, ravenest :). I'm sorry I misunderstood your post.


Ash
 

sacredashes

chriske said:
Boy, that was one tough group that you had! My comment on seekers being beyond good and evil really looks very naive (and downright foolish) on reflection. So be it.

No more naive (or foolish) than any one of us who look back and are stunned at some of the things we did, thought, felt... If we notice a difference or a change in our perception, it might just mean that we took a baby step forward. :)

Since we're sharing quotes from giants of the past, here's one that I found to be quite enlightening. Bear in mind though, its taken out of context (from Wikipedia no less! })) but this part of the quote seems like someone who has met his/her inner beast.

"......I see now how imbecile I was, how hideously wrong and weak it is to reject any part of one's personality."

Its not an easy thing, facing ourselves; I found the hardest thing to do in my own life is to look hard at the mirror that flatters not.


Ash
 

fyreflye

"He's not the Messiah; he's a very naughty boy." -Judith Iscariot in "The Life of Brian"

Sounds about right to me :D
 

ravenest

Crowley's 'evil' seems more the horror movie / spookey / supernatural / ammoral type of 'evil' perfect for disturbing post Victorian society (or getting the would-be-magician to explore his reactions to an outmoded - although still influential - social psycology).

Some people will, however, for their own reasons and influences, react against Crowley's 'evil' as some type of existential threat, while taking a really evil guy { http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=102717 } with a grain of salt.
 

Satori

So, I don't know all the horrid Crowley stories, I still need to read about him in detail, but I've been on the forum for long enough to have heard about this bad boy, so I will say this. I think part of why people hate him so much, is that he indulged his shall we say, lusty impulses? I think many of us live in the middle of the road. We don't veer left or right too much, we don't experiment with the banquet laid before us.

Most of us are too good if there is such a thing. Now don't hit me with the...what about....and give the list of names of anarchists, despots, the UniBomber whatever...those were different cases.

Crowley seemed to me, to be making a joke of everything he did, but really, he was making fun of convention and of society. As if he were thinking, what will They do if I do this....shoot a rare bird, ruin someone's marriage, wreak havoc in lives....whatever it was. As if he were trying to shake folks out of some kind of malaise.

So many of us are afraid to Live...what will happen....what will they think....what will the repercussions be...that we become immobilized and can't get out of our own way. And perhaps we do nothing. Perhaps we never savor anything....we never dare.

I don't excuse him of his Supreme Horribleness! But, he did Live his life. And the work he left behind, like Mozart, perhaps speaks better to who he really was than does his escapades?
 

Discordia

I love the guy.

Even as child, I was a seeker. I remember going to the library to search on the occult - and there it was: a bio of Uncle Al. I opened the book to a random page, only to fall upon a story about him bedding the maid on his mother's bed as a young man.

I was quite young myself, definitely a virgin (or close enough).

I couldn't wait to get that book home and read more. Heh.

He was much more than any given story taken out of context - as are all of us.

A lot of people will never really make up their minds about him.

Some bio/article writers re: him reveal much more of their own personal biases than reveal anything of import about his life and times. Always have. Always will.

Certainly, as many here have pointed out, accounts of his exploits vary wildly.

I even adore the "sordid" stories about him, although I suspect that much of it is apocryphal.

I am sure AC would not have it any other way...

...and THAT is a large part of the reason I love him. :D
 

Abrac

In this day and age it's hard for for us to imagine why people were so shocked and apalled by Crowley's behavior, but back then it was unheard of. It's sort of like when Marilyn Manson first hit the scene. People were horrified. Every generation has to take it up a notch to get noticed.
 

Discordia

Abrac said:
In this day and age it's for for us to imagine why people were so shocked and apalled by Crowley's behavior, but back then it was unheard of. It's sort of like when Marilyn Manson first hit the scene. People were horrified. Every generation has to take it up a notch to get noticed.

Too true, Abrac!

lol

But you see -- it kind of makes you wonder what shall be next?

Scary thought.

Or perhaps, not so scary?

Hmmm...I can see a point at which a return to modesty and being very austere would be taken by many to be a shocking, rebellous act.

Someone's mother asks her daughter, "Why don't you wear something a bit more skimpy?!? Don't forget to get drunk tonight!"

Perhaps this point is already here. Sadly, I know a mother who is very close to acting like that with her daughter. Her daughter happens to be 14.

:(



x.
 

mac22

Discordia said:
Too true, Abrac!

lol

But you see -- it kind of makes you wonder what shall be next?

Scary thought.

Or perhaps, not so scary?

Hmmm...I can see a point at which a return to modesty and being very austere would be taken by many to be a shocking, rebellous act.

Someone's mother asks her daughter, "Why don't you wear something a bit more skimpy?!? Don't forget to get drunk tonight!"

Perhaps this point is already here. Sadly, I know a mother who is very close to acting like that with her daughter. Her daughter happens to be 14.

:(



x.

Notch! Crowley used a pogo stick:D

mac22
 

gregory

When I grow up I want to marry the guy................ })

I like naughty, witty lusty guys.... and at least he was interesting.