Prince of Swords

[caridwen]

This card has been throwing itself at me and coming up in every reading I do with the Thoth and I haven't a clue what it's message is. Can someone please tell me what this is trying to say? Does it mean that I must cut away anything holding me back?

 

[Dean]

Hi there

I think of this is card of cutting away things from us that are holding us back, the card has the central male figure sweeping away the ties with the sword in his right hand, which are being held by the other three figures infront.

I also see this card as a cooling off stage in a relationship it's a sign of wanting more independence and wanting more freedom.

Just some thoughts

 

[Teheuti]

Does it mean that I must cut away anything holding me back?

I think he would only cut away things if that is what logic dictates - not gratuitously. He is Air of Air and since the Princes are associated with Tiphareth he is most closely aligned with the 6 of Swords - Science (also one of his cards among the 3 associated decanates). The card suggests acting as the objective mind that solves problems through analysis and reason.

 

[ravenest]

This card has been throwing itself at me and coming up in every reading I do with the Thoth and I haven't a clue what it's message is. Can someone please tell me what this is trying to say? Does it mean that I must cut away anything holding me back?

[We have discussions on cards and what they might mean. But what a specific card might mean in context of a persons reading, condidering we know nothing of it's aspects (the cards around it) or its postion or even what spread is a little difficult, so I'd suggest that most answers you get (excepting from the highly intuitive) are based on a single isolated understanding of the card, which may very greatly in your reading.]

The three entities pulling the chariot are representive of the the three Gunas. When they are equally balanced and under the direction of the charioteer the chariot moves forward under the direction of the one who is SUPPOSED TO BE in charge of it.

If not (balanced and contolled) then the gunas will not be at an harmoniuos end. eg. one might catch its eye on something of interest 'off the path' another might be frightened or shied away (I'm using a horse/chariot analogy now), the third one obedient to the charioteer.

The chariots route will then be an average vector of the contending forces and probably not the same as the initial will of the charioteer.

For further understanding of the Gunas see BoT or The Wheel of Fortune (The 3 animals on the wheel represent the 3 Gunas). They are aspects of our self that should be integrated and under the control of the Master Magician, Real Self, Oversoul, Charioteer or CICT - Centrum in Trigono Centri (The one in the centre of the triangle) - or whatever term you like -they are not meant to be individual sepreated entities whose lack of evolution causes the negative wheel of karma to revolve pointlessly throughout our incarnations:

" TYPHON
Brother Hermanubis, what is the hour?
HERMANUBIS
Noon. Brother Typhon, what is the place?
TYPHON
The summit of Olympus. Brother Hermanubis, what is thy position?
HERMANUBIS
Upon the rim of the Wheel. And Thine?
TYPHON
Upon the rim of the Wheel.
HERMANUBIS
Let us seek the centre of the Wheel.
They with SPHINX rise and walk, faster and faster round the rim, returning exhausted to their places.
TYPHON
Brother Hermanubis, we are no nearer to the centre of the wheel.
HERMANUBIS
We are no nearer to the centre of the wheel."

Nor each with their own agends and in conflict with each other;

"HERMANUBIS
Hail unto Thee, that hast the secret of Jupiter!
Declare unto us, we beseech Thee, the mystery whereby we may approach the centre of the wheel.

SPHINX plays a riddling sarcastic music.

TYPHON goes to his place in terror.

HERMANUBIS goes to his place in wonderment.

SPHINX
Neither by sloth nor by activity may even my secret be attained.
Neither by emotion nor by reason may even I be understood. How then should ye come to the centre of the wheel?

HERMANUBIS
Mother of mystery, what is thy position on Olympus?

SPHINX
Upon the rim of the wheel.

SPHINX plays the most exalted (passionless because beyond passion) piece that she may.

HERMANUBIS
This means nothing to me.

TYPHON
I feel nothing.

C.I.C.T
1. Mother of Mystery, declare my mind.

SPHINX plays a cold, passionless, intellectual piece.

HERMANUBIS
Ah! Ah! This is music; this is the secret of Jupiter.

TYPHON
I feel nothing.

C.I.C.T
1. Mother of Mystery, declare my heart.

SPHINX plays an intensely sensual passionate piece.

TYPHON
Ah! Ah! This is music; this is the secret of Jupiter.

HERMANUBIS
Accursed! Accursed! be the soul of impurity, the body of Sin!

C.I.C.T
1. Irreconcilable, my children, how shall ye partake of the Banquet of Jupiter, or come to the centre of the wheel? For this is the secret of Jupiter, that He who created you is in each of you, yet apart from all; before Him ye are equal, revolving in time and in Space; but he is unmoved and within.

C.I.C.T
Feeling, and thought, and ecstasy
Are but the cerements of Me.
Thrown off like planets from the Sun
Ye are but satellites of the One.
But should your revolution stop

Ye would inevitably drop
Headlong within the central Soul,
And all the parts become the Whole.
Sloth and activity and peace,
When will ye learn that ye must cease?"

For me, the Prince of Swords represents the powers of holding all these things together... it does require discipline, a strong will and a number of swords (including the sickle, the sword of destruction and harvest and the straight edge cross hilt sword, the sword of creation and direction.

{Quotes from Crowley's Rite of Jupiter}

 

[mooiedragon]

Hmm.... I'm definately going to have to read the Quotes from Ravenest a couple more times to truly understand them, but until then here are my thoughts on the Prince of Swords.

This is an active thinker. Air of Air. Intellectual intellect. He most likely has a lot of things on the go, but few of them probably have purpose or practicality attached to them. It's even less likely that he has any notion of following these ideas through to fruition and in fact, will probably "change his mind" at some stage. This guy can be the epitome of disorganized. Because he has nothing to ground him - neither passion, emotion or practicality, his ideas can be contradictory and never end up going anywhere.

However, there is this quote from the Book of Thoth, that apparently holds the "secret crown" relating to the child's head on the Prince. "If concentrated it is exactly Tipareth"

I'm only just starting to learn about the Qabbalistic theories and how they are integrated, but I interpret that as meaning if the Prince is pure of heart, and all his ideas are born of good intentions, he has the ability to succeed.

I don't know, though. Any one else?

 

[Aeon418]

This is an active thinker. Air of Air. Intellectual intellect. He most likely has a lot of things on the go, but few of them probably have purpose or practicality attached to them. It's even less likely that he has any notion of following these ideas through to fruition and in fact, will probably "change his mind" at some stage. This guy can be the epitome of disorganized. Because he has nothing to ground him - neither passion, emotion or practicality, his ideas can be contradictory and never end up going anywhere.

I think it's important to figure in the astrology of the court cards rather than just see them as purely elemental. The Prince of Swords rules from the 20th degree of Capricorn to the 20th degree of Aquarius. That makes them two thirds Air and one third Earth.

People represented by this card are very intellectual but that does not stop them from being seriously hard workers and very practical.

I speak from experience.

 

[Teheuti]

I think it's important to figure in the astrology of the court cards rather than just see them as purely elemental. The Prince of Swords rules from the 20th degree of Capricorn to the 20th degree of Aquarius. That makes them two thirds Air and one third Earth.

People represented by this card are very intellectual but that does not stop them from being seriously hard workers and very practical.

I speak from experience.

Aeon - Thanks for the insight and I appreciate that you speak from experience. However, since Air and Earth are elemental "enemies" I suggest that the Prince of Swords struggles to be practical and tries to maintain hard physical activity. There may even be a quality of overcompensation in the realm of Capricorn through a feeling of being not quite good enough.

What do you think?

Mary

 

[Aeon418]

Aeon - Thanks for the insight and I appreciate that you speak from experience. However, since Air and Earth are elemental "enemies" I suggest that the Prince of Swords struggles to be practical and tries to maintain hard physical activity. There may even be a quality of overcompensation in the realm of Capricorn through a feeling of being not quite good enough.

What do you think?

I think the opposition between Air and Earth is very similar to the opposition between Fire and Water. The two elements are antagonistic towards each other but sometimes they work like perfect complimentary opposites. Almost a hand-in-glove style relationship.

When the elements are in opposition I think this often leads to sky high standards and unrealistic expectations that just can't be met in practice. This has the knock on effect of sometimes sending the Capricorn element into over drive chasing after perfection.

Personally I find this manifests itself in a slightly contradictory way. For example in a work environment I am totally relaxed and laid back if other people make mistakes. It's not a problem and things can always be put right. But if I make a mistake I end up beating myself up over it. I expect nothing but the best from myself.
These high standards can have a positive effect though. I find it very easy to motivate myself and am very self reliant. It's rare that I need motivation from an outside source. But to counter this if I can't motivate myself nobody else stands a chance either.

Another aspect of this elemental opposition that I notice in myself is that I will frequently question orders and commands and try to reason out motivations, but at the end of the day I will still get on with the work whether I like it or not.

Another thing that comes to mind is that I can feel uncomfortable about practical things unless I gain a full intellectual understanding beforehand. Lets put is this way, I'm the sort of person that reads the instruction manual first.

Sometimes I can be very indecisive and torn between ideas. But if I manage to balance the two contending forces of Air the practical Earth element takes over in a big way. Full steam ahead.

 

[Teheuti]

I think the opposition between Air and Earth etc.

Aeon - Wow, what a great description. This makes the Prince of Swords into a real person with very complex human characteristics. I can certainly see what you are saying. What would be the greatest down side of these qualities? Do power struggles sometimes get in the way of Aquarian brother/sisterhood? Or is it more the other way around?

I'll be gone for a few days but would love to see what you say when I get back?

Mary

 

[Aeon418]

What would be the greatest down side of these qualities? Do power struggles sometimes get in the way of Aquarian brother/sisterhood? Or is it more the other way around?

I think the Prince of Swords makes a good friend. He's flexible, adaptable and generally easy going. But he is like the Air, it goes where it wants to. This Prince deeply resents being controlled. That's when the Capricorn stubbornness rears it's ugly head. This Prince only listens to his own advice.

In a very contradictory Air-like way the Prince's greatest strength is also his greatest weakness. His highly developed sense of detached objectivity is both a blessing and a curse. (I believe you already made the connection with the 6 of Swords.) This Prince faces the facts as they are. There's no rose-tinting, sweetening up or dumbing down. He just prefers the plain facts and he's not afraid to speak them either. This combined with his razor sharp whit and well developed sense of humour often form a lethal combination.

I think this is where the Prince of Swords gets his bad reputation for being unemotional and uncaring. While some people see him as direct, frank, free, and open. Others see him as blunt, tactless, outspoken, and even down right rude or offensive. This Prince finds it very difficult to sugar-coat his words. He's a plain speaker. Some people like this and find it refreshing. Others hate it in varying degrees dependent on their own emotional make up.

The Prince of Swords is one of those people that you either like a lot or hate their guts right from the first time you meet them.