SixDegrees
Thank you for the list!
how I read the GT
Izzydunne
Sixdegrees:
Your welcome, thank you for appreciating my efforts.
Your welcome, thank you for appreciating my efforts.
Izzydunne
Daphne:
The idea of fate/freewill is always interesting. Life is mixture of both. From my perspective, fated events happen for the following reason: Life is boot camp. It is very challenging, and the planet runs on fear. We come here as eternal beings who take a body to work on soul growth lessons. Prior to an incarnation, we will sit down with elders who will advise on creating events in the life to come which will bring about the soul growth we desire from that particular incarnation. Of course, once who are born into a body the events will happen (fate), and how you respond to the event is free will. There is also free will for any part of life that has not been pre-planned prior to incarnation.
About the Cross..........Yes it is suffering, and not to be dressed up as something mild. Being crucified is a most painful and torturous experience. Look at the Lenormand playing card inserts. Most of the challenging cards are clubs. Back in the day, old school card readers saw the suit of clubs as the bad cards, because they looked like a crucifix.
And yes, I am happy to answer any of your questions. I actually enjoy this.
The idea of fate/freewill is always interesting. Life is mixture of both. From my perspective, fated events happen for the following reason: Life is boot camp. It is very challenging, and the planet runs on fear. We come here as eternal beings who take a body to work on soul growth lessons. Prior to an incarnation, we will sit down with elders who will advise on creating events in the life to come which will bring about the soul growth we desire from that particular incarnation. Of course, once who are born into a body the events will happen (fate), and how you respond to the event is free will. There is also free will for any part of life that has not been pre-planned prior to incarnation.
About the Cross..........Yes it is suffering, and not to be dressed up as something mild. Being crucified is a most painful and torturous experience. Look at the Lenormand playing card inserts. Most of the challenging cards are clubs. Back in the day, old school card readers saw the suit of clubs as the bad cards, because they looked like a crucifix.
And yes, I am happy to answer any of your questions. I actually enjoy this.
Seraphina
Hi IzzyDunne, I too want to thank you for your list, as Daphne has said, I too use most of your meanings, I also like the idea of only a few meanings per card, for a beginner like me it makes learning so much more straight forward... Could I ask you why you use the Anchor as a job card? I have been kind of following the French school of meanings because I have Rana's book, I know the anchor stands for stability and security but I have not used it for employment, the deck I'm using has a career card anyway... I'm just interested in which system you use, it's always good to look at all possibilities and others meanings .. You obviously are a Lenormand pro, I have read some of your posts with great interest.. I'm very new lol so it's good to get advice from traditional Lenormand readers
daphne
Thank you for agreeing to answer some extra questions. And, especially, thank you for you openness, not taking my questions like an negative judgement on tradition and such. With Lenormand I am also following tradition, and now I ask from candid curiosity and willingness to keep it simple with Lenormand. And I liked your point in the other thread about keeping simple.
Going back to the cross, for me it is a little bit contradicting (with the meaning of life, which I see it as a quest to discover and develop the divine side of us) and thus I dont understand how can I see it only suffering. I will explain more. It is like we are born fated to suffer, every single month, week, day (whatever period is the GT laid for) and all our free will is to chose how we respond to this suffering. I (like to) think we are born to be happy and make happy around.
Let`s say I have a GT for next month and it is mostly about a wedding happening that month, happy union result of love and such. There will be the cross there somewhere, all the cards are on the table, we end up reading all as all are interconnected. No matter what good times are we looking at, there will be always the cross. Then it is like there will be always the suffering? I dont want to make it mild, cross it is suffering but is it in all cases/GT? About the wedding that month, is it not about the fate?
And now I come to another question. How do you lay GT in terms of time? Do you consider it for a certain period, 1-2..-6 months? Do you lay it to see the energies around a certain event?
Next question (and a more of explanation about the cross) - when I started Lenromand, few years back, I quit very fast as it seemed to me as the most negative, pessimistic and mean sort of cartomancy. In every GT there they were - the cross, the coffin, the whip, the snake - literately a bouquet of bad news and suffering. No hope, no advice. Later on I pick it up again, as its simplicity still attracted me, and nuances appeared: cross was not just suffering, whip can be a healthy argument clearing up the air, coffin with ending helps you go on, snake can invite you to adapt, fox can teach you lessons. Still with Lenormand, very often I miss the support part, I prefer readings that help with an advice. So, the question is, do you use it for advice (and if yes, how?)? Or just as an epic description of what's in the air now and most probable to come?
Lee
Hi daphne,
I know you addressed your post to Izzydunne, but if you don't mind, I'd like to address this part of your post. I'm just a beginner myself, but I've been hovering around the edges of Lenormand study for years, and I think I can provide a valid answer to this part of your question.
I personally am learning traditional meanings, and I can tell you that most traditional readers see certain cards, definitely including the Cross, as always negative.
Three points:
1) The reason there are negative cards in Lenormand is that, unfortunately, negative events/thoughts/feelings are a part of life, and in a system that purports to show us an accurate picture of events/thoughts/feelings, some negative indicators are necessary. If you want your readings to offer constructive advice, negative factors can still be a part of that, i.e. "If you continue down this path, unfavorable events may result, therefore you may want to rethink your approach."
2) Beginners are often told that for daily draws, the cards are more likely to refer to mundane situations and usually not life-changing big issues. Clearly for any reading, not just daily draws, the cards may operate at different levels. You determine the level by considering the context of the question and the surrounding cards. If the Cross comes up in a reading about a wedding, it may mean that the bride will leave the groom at the altar, but it may also mean that the groom is sad because a loved family member or friend couldn't come to the wedding. Or it may mean that the bride will stub her toe at the reception.
3) Many people read the GT in such a way that not every card is read. As I understand it, readers often look first to what cards surround the focus card(s), then to the vertical and horizontal lines that include the focus card(s). So there are many cards in a GT which aren't read at all. So even though the Cross appears, it may not necessarily need to be referenced in a reading.
daphne
Absolutely. Agree. But not in every event is a sad part. But in every GT is the Cross. Is this not contradicting with only the sadness/suffering meaning?
Your examples qualifies for a cross reading as suffering. But what if none of them make a case for that wedding. What if there is no sadness this time? What is cross saying? Do we ignore it?
I know that many people do not read all the cards in the GT. I do look at all, the closer to the charged card being more important. But the far ones are still there, there is an influence, they do play a role. Why having a GT if you dont read them? Just have a 9-12-18 layout, no?
And thank you for your answer, it is a public discussion, everybody is welcome to share their views.
dancing_moon
I'm one of those people who don't read all the cards in the GT.
It makes no real sense to me to read all of them, simply because they're the same 36 cards every time.
That's why I only choose certain 'meaningful' subsets of cards, like horizontals or mirrors, and the rest of the cards are simply ignored because they identify the areas/issues which aren't currently present or important for this querent/question. So, if the Cross isn't present in any meaningful sets, then suffering/questions of fate are not important right now.Why not use a 9/12/18-card layout instead? I like it that even though not all the cards are read, they definitely provide a structure for the layout. But if you find this illogical, you could try staying with smaller spreads where you read every single card.
Also, I've read somewhere that a card far removed from the significator is read as its opposite. E.g. the Cross next to the Lady means suffering, but the Cross far from the Lady means lack of suffering/life's easy for you.
Hope this helps.
daphne
I'm one of those people who don't read all the cards in the GT.
It makes no real sense to me to read all of them, simply because they're the same 36 cards every time.
Sure, they are the same 36 every time. But not considering them all, keeping of course the issue of closeness to the significator as main rule, does not make sense to me. The cards are the same, but their placement is every time different.dancing_moon
Well, then you need to find your way, the one that would make sense to you.
