Tarot vs. Religion

[Thea Lynx]

Hi Dead Star,

I was raised heavy duty catholic and only left that path five years ago - I won't go into the long list of my problems with that church, they are my own and I wouldn't try to influence anyone or want to seem like I was engaged in catholic-bashing, which is not the case. I became pagan long before I took up the Tarot as a serious study. But it is not because I am pagan. I was drawn to the Tarot long, long ago, but did not embark upon serious study for a number of reasons.

There is room for the Tarot in any faith path. Any faith path will have its conservatives, liberals and hard core fundamentalists. I do not judge them, I refuse to allow them to judge me.

Should I ever return to christianity, or any path other than that which I am now on, the Tarot will go with me. It is not a religion, it is a path to self-awareness that expands my soul, my beliefs, my intuition, my participation in the world.

Thea Lynx

 

[Khatruman]

This type of question comes around again every so often, where a tarot enthusiast encounters a religious adherent who does his or her best to convince the tarotist that the cards are evil. Someone who works hard to do this has most probably shut down a previously open mind and one can really do nothing more than "hang up" as you have done, whether that is to literally shut off the conversation or pleasantly divert it. More times than not, I have heard the closed-minded person to be a "Christian."

Without launching into my thoughts and experiences again, I would rather use this opportunity to offer my latest observation on the religion/tarot clash, geared more specifically to Christianity and tarot. I have found that there are two extremes among followers of Christianity as to how they stand on the issue of tarot. Of course, people being people and different depending on who you talk to, not all Christians fall onto one or the other side, but my experience has shown it to be quite polarized.

You will have the Christian who sees more in the spirit of Christianity, and will embrace tarot as a tool to become closer to God, seeing its positive ability to help one tap into an understanding of God and the world. If Christ answered the question on what is the greatest commandment with two: love your neighbor as yourself, and love God with all your heart, then this group will see tarot's possibility in allowing one to connect with his fellow human, through reading and understanding each other, and its possibility of being closer to God, in seeing that a deep force works in all things, including the cards.

Then you will have the Christian who looks more at the religion of Christianity, following the rules taught in church and the warnings of Satan's temptations. This Christian's faith is built on obeying the teachings of the sheperds of the church and not thinking independently, but following. Straying from any path not laid out explicitly by Scripture and Pastor constitutes falling onto the Devil's path. To this Christian, tarot has been taught, if taught at all, to be an instrument of Satan to sway God's followers. God commands and we are to obey.

I think it was in Rachel Pollack's wonderful book The Forest of Souls where I picked up a new understanding even of the Scripture linguistically which makes a significant difference. In many English translations of the Scriptures, there is a word that is translates as "commands"--that God commands this, and God commands that. Command is an assertive, if not aggressive word, and gives one the impression of a domineering parent's edict. The word that is translated as "command" though, actually is closer in meaning to the English word "desire": God desires us to do this, God desires that we be that way. What a more magnificent word is "desires"! There is a deeper emotional connection in that word, a heat and fire. There is intimacy and closeness, as of a God who is not towering over us and barking commands, but of one wrapped around us and expressing love and wants.

I prefer to see God as deeply entwined within me, around me, through all humanity rather than one aloof, above and glaring down upon me. God is not just the blinding Sun in the sky, but the warm rays that pour through my skin, lights my world.

Hope I made some sense here.

 

[Kath]

When I got my Thoth deck, very early in my tarot journey, I ordered it through the mail, and had it delivered to work (as opposed to home, where I’d have to pick the parcel up from the post office). Being rather naive, I wanted to show them off. I showed them to my boss, who is a devout Christian.

My boss literally jumped back about a foot, and told me that tarot was evil, that it was used to conjure demons and communicate with the devil, and that I shouldn’t ‘play’ with them, because I risked possession, or summoning evil beings into my life.

To say that I was shocked would be an understatement. This came from a man whom I respect, and whom I consider an intelligent person, and with whom I’ve had some very interesting and insightful discussions on theology and Christianity.

After this, my boss and I had a little talk and I asked him what was the Christian view on tarot cards and the like. He basically said that divination was wrong, and against the teachings of the bible. Of course, it’s different if a Christian has a ‘gift’ whereby they can see the future (that’s a gift from God), but tarot was the tool of the devil (as are astrology, runes, etc.)

That little incident taught me to be careful with who I show my cards to, and to never assume the way people will react. It also makes me a little wary of having my cards or reading a tarot book in public. I don’t think I could do readings in a coffee shop for fear of having someone telling me I’m going to hell.

But, in my boss’s defence, he has never preached to me, or told me I was going to hell, and we still continue to have very interesting discussions about theology

 

[DeLani]

Yes, we get that sort of thing all the time here in the Bible Belt. And I think it's getting worse, more virulent, with Bush II in office. (Seriously - holy war type stuff).
I've been beat up at school, told I couldn't silently meditate on the cards in the library (though vocally praying to the Hebrew/Christian god was OK), and even had parents sign a petition to get me kicked out of a middle school because I was a Witch! (which I am - and how did they find out? Someone broke into my locker and found my Tarot cards! Did they get in trouble for stealing? No...)
I did an interview with the local news station about Wicca on Halloween (of course), and part of the interview dealt with the Tarot (I of course pointed out that you don't have to be a Witch to use the Tarot, and pointed out all the Christian symbolism, etc...). While the segment that was aired was pretty good, it had to start off with comments from "the other side of the aisle" - they actually had a Catholic priest on talking about how Wicca is Satanism! Now would they have done that if they were interviewing a Jew about Hannukah?
These types of Christians are so pushy - they have no regard for freedom of religion, or even common respect for other people's beliefs. They want the world to do as they do, and are not above using violence to enforce their beliefs.

 

[nocturnaldreamr]

i was baptised into the christian faith.. my parents doing.
i grew up and went to church, and to me i never really "got" it, and it became a chore for me to go. i hated going and came up with every excuse i could to not go (like clean my room. hahah). after awhile my parents got sick of my b.s and my opinions so i was allowed not to go. i have taken religion classes and i have read some parts of the bible and like, it just never made sense to me.
i went through a bad time, after i started to learn about the world we live in and then all the happenings in it (sept 11, war in iraq...) and then this started to make me think of all the past things in history that have happened and i came up with all sorts of questions and i drove my mother crazee with them.
she hated when i asked them, because she never had an answer for me (because she is very sensitive with her faith and won't open mindingly answer my ponderings), so i went to the minister at the church i used to go to. ( i never really quit the church for good, i just didnt go. i still went to social crap for the teens like the 30 hour famine retreat.. FUN).. anyways, i talked to the minister for 2 and a half hours, and it was amazing, i was getting some answers, but they werent to my liking. he was pretty biased in his answering and it did feel he was trying to sell me his faith.
i wanted to know the good ol question about adam+eve= cain and able (2 men...) where's their ladies?.. and with so limited 1st people, wouldn't mankind be inbreded? if god promised no more floods, why was there MORE floods?, is god so loved his people, why is there pain, poverty, disease, wars, intolerance, unexceptingness etc etc etc?...
i told him about how i am fasinated with the tarot and astrology. i told him i had played around with ouija boards before, tarot, and i had checked my horoscope. according to his bible, that meant id go to hell and all that crap. he was saying that u had to have faith and not look into the future.
i then had a huge question that was the result of my religion class and the learning of all religions.
all religions say they accept others, don't kill.. blah blah love your neighbour..
however... they say if you follow any other "god", your "going to hell"... so what i was thinking, does this mean, that in the eyes of muslims who believe in their "god", are hindus going to hell for believing in their "gods" and not muslim "god", or in the eyes of hindus, are muslims going to hell for believing in their "god" and not hindu "gods".????
this is alot of my babbling....
any one have any opinion on what i babbled?
i'd love to know what you think!
=o)

 

[Aura Wolf]

Thank you all for your replies. They were very interesting and insightful. It amazes me how awful people can be. I'll have to think about this some more, I've just had a bad day in general. I'd love to hear more. I think everyone should have equal rights and respect the beliefs of others, it's the only humane way to live in my opinion. Otherwise what's the point?

 

[Aura Wolf]

Alright, here are my views on the subject. So just bear with me while I vent...

I believe all people should be treated equally, no matter what their beliefs or lifestyles are. People should respect others and what they believe in, because if you can't do that then what's the point of living? If someone is going to devote their life to something that has no absolute proof of existence or truth then they should at least let others do the same.

Belief can have no right or wrong. It's discrimination. Despite what we believe for ourselves, we should be tolerant of all cultures and religions. I support gay rights and pro-choice abortion just as I support Christianity and Buddhism and all religions and beliefs without actually practicing these things myself. How one can enjoy themselves in their own life if they devote their time to making it difficult for other people, I don't know. We have no right to assume that our religion or beliefs is the only true faith or righteous path, because there is no proof and because we all deserve to live in an unbiased society. No one should pass judgement on things they dont understand, and when they do understand others' beliefs and lifestyles they should really keep their negative opinions/comments to themselves, because nothing gets accomplished by trying to force our beliefs on others, except making them feel attacked and hurt.

I really dont understand why people are so opposed to tarot, though. I know plenty of Christians and all sorts of people who practice tarot as a way to bring them closer to God and their understanding of life, which is the true purpose of tarot. I find it interesting what Kath said about Christianity, for example. If the Bible is against such things as tarot, runes, and other divination tools that are used to "tell the future" but at the same time supports self-prophecy, the ability to see the future as a natural gift from God, there is a remarkable contradiction here. They often believe that somehow by using tarot cards, which are essentially cardboard and ink, we are running the risk of contacting the spirit world and allowing ourselves to become possessed by demons, and things of that nature. But most tarot readers will agree with me that this is impossible, as tarot cards have absolutely no supernatural powers. They are, truly, cardboard with pretty pictures on them. That being said, all power in using most divination tools is within the reader, the person who uses them by relying on their own judgement. And if that is truly the case, and the fact were made widely known to people who believe otherwise, wouldn't that also be considered "a gift from God"?

To me this seems quite silly on their part, and I feel much better having thought of it. It's ridiculous to think such a thing can be evil really, and I feel sorry for people who allow themselves to be that, well really, dumb. I have no problem with them believing or not believing in something, but if their beliefs against such things as tarot cards are contradicted by their belief in natural God-given gifts to the people who possess them, there really is no logic or basis behind such reasoning that tarot cards are evil or dangerous.

I'm in no way directing this at Christians in general of course, only towards that specific group and anyone else who passes judgement on things they don't understand, because it's really quite silly. I've decided that the next time anyone tries to attack my belief in tarot, I'm simply going to say, "They're cards and ink. Get over it."

 

[Phoenyx*]

I had a somewhat unsettling experience a few minutes ago and just wanted to share it with everyone. My Tarot of Mermaids that I have been awaiting for 2 months from Chapters Books in Canada was just recently cancelled from my order as they were unable to order it in. Currently, I am visiting with my grandparents in Penticton, B.C. so I decided I could try the local bookstores to see if they had it. There was only one main bookstore that I wanted to get ahold of, but I accidentally called the wrong number and reached a Christian bookstore. I didn't realize this until after I asked them if they had tarot decks. At first the woman didn't seem to understand me, but then she realized I meant tarot cards and said, "No, we are a Christian bookstore," and told me they didn't sell those kinds of items (she referred to "those items" with a specific word, but I can't remember what it was. All I know is it was something "non-Christian" or of that nature). I apologized and told her I meant to reach another bookstore, when she began to launch into a lecture about how I shouldn't be using those kinds of things, and what would happen if I got into them. I was shocked and as soon as I realized what was happening, I hung up the phone (as bad as that made me feel). Despite being a polite person I was not about to sit there and have some woman with no real knowledge of tarot lecture me on its evils and wrongdoings.

Even though I didn't stick around long enough to listen to much of this, I got the jist of what she thought about it and how she was trying to force this kind of belief on me that it was wrong. It was definitely uncomfortable, as I've never encountered this before. There are people who don't believe in tarot and that's fine, but I've never had someone actually try to preach to me about it being evil when they obviously know nothing about what it truly is and isn't. Especially from someone at a reputable bookstore, and over the telephone no less!

I know there are many Christians who use tarot cards, I in fact used to be one myself before I converted to Paganism and spirituality. But some people are just incredibly close-minded, no matter what their religious or ethical beliefs.

I'd like to start a discussion on this. If anyone has had similar experiences I'd love for them to share, and I'd also like to know what your views are on the subject of tarot vs. religion. How misunderstood is it really, and what is the general view on tarot in other religions? How do people arrive at the conclusions and assumptions that tarot is, essentially, a "tool of the devil"? Is there any way we could raise awareness on this?

Heh, apparently Dead Star, you've never been to Mississippi. Being a witch (and "out" about it), I've had things from people trying nicely to "save my soul" to people honking at me on the Interstate and waving Bibles at me. And when they find out that I also read Tarot....heh....yeah Delani is right, it has gotten so much worse since Bush II is in office. People have gotten so much more intolerable.
Tarot seems to make it all worse. Being a witch is bad enough in their eyes, but reading Tarot as well....its unheard of for them! I've gotten mixed feelings from people who just think that I read the cards, from a polite eye-rolling, to "What's she gonna do, have a full time job during the week and read Tarot cards during the weekend?!" *laughter*
*sighs deeply* That's why I love this place so much, I can actually freely talk about my love of Tarot.

 

[Simone]

Re: Re: Tarot vs. Religion

...I've had things from people trying nicely to "save my soul" to people honking at me on the Interstate and waving Bibles at me.

Having been raised in a mild catholic environment (I "left the club" about 10 years ago), but having had the incredible luck to have parents who let me have my choice, I've never been in contact with this kind of fanaticism, except from a distance. But it leaves me shocked each time I encounter it - how can one not respect other people's choices?

And then the big question about how do those people come to the conclusion that Tarot is evil?? There must be going on a real huge campaign of misinformation and intentional occultation, and all this about a few "scraps of cardboard with pictures on them"

It all just leaves me puzzled and real sorry for what's happening. And, by the way, I have never heard of something similar in European countries, at least not nowadays (witch hunting and burnings are out since a few years )

Trying to save a soul by taking away the possibility to choose ... wow, how incongruent.

But I realise it's the choice they made...

Love
Simone

 

[brandi124]

Re: Re: Tarot vs. Religion

yeah Delani is right, it has gotten so much worse since Bush II is in office. People have gotten so much more intolerable.

That is so true. It reminds me a lot of things I read about the era of McCarthyism. When people are scared they are capable of some pretty awful behavior. It's like people want to feel secure at any cost-- even if it means incriminating innocent people just for being different. Has anyone seen the movie "Bowling for Columbine"? I think it should be mandatory viewing all across America and I'd highly recommend it to anyone abroad.