Tarot of Marseilles help desk (Frequently Asked Questions): Non-History

Moonbow

I've got the Maxwell book. It wasn't difficult to buy in a shop here. At first I found it very difficult to understand, and if I were an expert I would probably find alot that I disagreed with in it. But, second time around it's making more sense to me (does this mean I'm improving! :) ). It's helping alot with the card meanings and throwing up meanings I hadn't thought of. I would say its's worth getting, if for nothing else - it's in English!
 

Centaur

Centaur said:
But I think I will pass on the Marseille for the moment.

I take that comment back.

I just ordered the Fournier. Can you believe that my once anti-Marseille ass has just purchased one?!

I will soon find out what all the fuss is about when it drops through my door in the next few days.

C
 

firemaiden

Centaur said:
Can you believe that my once anti-Marseille ass has just purchased one?!

LOL, good one Centaur.
 

Centaur

Moonbow* said:
Centaur, I'm glad you changed your mind, we can bounce ideas off each other - if you want?

Yes. I would like that! I have Jewel-ry to blame for my recent purchase: she told me of the cheap price of the deck on aildastore.com. Ha!

C
 

lunakasha

I am very tempted to order one myself....thanks Centaur! :p

I checked alidastore.com for the Fournier, but not sure how "cheap" it would be for me since they would be shipping overseas....

But anyway, I have definitely caught the "fever" and am anxious to get started with the Marseille.....

:D Luna
 

Alta

The Marseille decks are certainly interesting and historical decks. They do carry an esoteric message but certainly are far from the only vehicle. People follow their own paths in their own ways in their own time.
 

jmd

Very glad to hear that Centaur and lunakasha may also soon enjoy a Marseille deck.

For what it's worth, some of my experiences with people around Melbourne who first come into contact with the Marseille is a little similar to those who first come into contact with Tarot generally: 'but how am I ever going to get use to these and understand them?'

Whereas other decks have images which are more common to our imaginations, the Marseilles has numerous lines which give the image certain ambiguities. Despite these ambiguities, the Marseille has an established pattern which makes it a Marseille, and not, for example, a Schaffhouse.

Additionally, and importantly, there is very much a sense that its specific pattern provides the characteristics as to whether a deck is a 'genuine' Tarot deck or not. The levels of deviations from the Marseille are where some have differing views. For example, if ordering is taken to be unalterable as an indicator of Tarot, the RWCS, and the Eteilla, fall out. If pip card scenes become such that their imagery become dominant over 'instrument' depictions, again some may view it as falling outside of 'proper' Tarot, and here again the RWCS and Sola Busca fall out.

Others will include those deviated decks as Tarot and see the close rapport between those modifications and the un-expressed pattern of the Ür-Tarot, or unmanifest archetypal Tarot - a pattern which many of us consider has its closest 'incarnation' in the varieties of Marseille decks.

So how does one begin? Aoife wrote a wonderful post two pages back which is well worth re-reading. To begin and to play with the cards, with their images, with how pairs may or may not relate...

To re-organise them in rows of two, of three, of four, ... or in pairs, in threes, ...in fives, etc, and begin to see how they relate.

To ask and seek to provisionally give one's own answer to questions such as:

What is 'globally' different betweent the first ten numbered cards and the last ten numbered cards (of the major arcana)?

If one just looks at the pips of the suit of cups, how many are there all together?

If the sixteen court cards are placed sequentially, what becomes striking?

These are some from amongst the numerous ways which may help in beginning to see into the Marseille (and other Tarot inspired decks, of course).

With regards to K.N. Newman's The Tarot: a myth of male initiation (which I read a number of years ago, and do not properly recall all its details), there is certainly much of worth. Specifically, the cards' images are also compared in terms of numerous other depictions which occur in various other instances. Where I do not go along with the book is in its specifically Jungian analysis as to its psychological 'meaning'... but then again, I find Jungian analysis generally wanting, in that it seeks to reduce the spiritual to mere psychological 'pressures' - thus negating its proper ontology.

Another book which may be of worth, and which pops up regularly in second-hand places, is R. Cavendish's Tarot. Though it does not deal specifically with the Marseille's iconography, it does address Tarot's imagery generally, and thus includes the Marseille's.
 

lunakasha

jmd said:
So how does one begin? Aoife wrote a wonderful post two pages back which is well worth re-reading. To begin and to play with the cards, with their images, with how pairs may or may not relate...

To re-organise them in rows of two, of three, of four, ... or in pairs, in threes, ...in fives, etc, and begin to see how they relate.

To ask and seek to provisionally give one's own answer to questions such as:

What is 'globally' different betweent the first ten numbered cards and the last ten numbered cards (of the major arcana)?

If one just looks at the pips of the suit of cups, how many are there all together?

If the sixteen court cards are placed sequentially, what becomes striking?

These are some from amongst the numerous ways which may help in beginning to see into the Marseille (and other Tarot inspired decks, of course).

Thanks, jmd....more practical information to get me started! :D
I will add those books to my list as well....hopefully between the books, my notes/interpretations and the History section of AT, I should be able to make a go of it....getting more confident all the time! :laugh:

But yes, first things first....need to get CARDS! :D
Thanks everyone for your help...I do appreciate your patience.

:) Luna
 

Moongold

Hello everyone,

Well I seem to have missed something but that is all right. I was doing readings with my wonderful Fournier.

Seriously, one of the best learning strategies is to DO and to practise :) I would love to see people read and post their readings in Your Readings so that we could all comment. I put a short reading there yesterday. The Marseilles is a very witty deck.

I second a comment made earlier about Sally Nicholls Jung and Tarot but I would also highly recommend Dr. Irene Gad's Tarot and Individuation. This is one of the most comprehensive and intelligent tarot guides I have seen. It covers the Marseilles symbolism, qabalah and Jungian analysis and much more. It is an indispensible reference in my view.

I am also finding Meditations on the Tarot immensely useful in this discovery process.


Moongold
 

Moongold

Jewel-ry said:
I guess the TdM is such a huge subject with so many sub-divisions of interest that trying to see the wood for the trees is sometimes disheartening.

For what its worth, I feel happier today. I got really bogged down with it all yesterday and ended up going off to 'play' with the RWS. (Is that a swear word on here?)

Thanks everyone for just being there when I was on a downer. I shall go back into my little corner and get my Marseille decks out now.

I think there is depth in every aspect of tarot, not just the Tarot de Marseilles. Isn't it how far you want to go? You could spend a life time simply with RWS or Thoth and never be bored

Every tarot "school" has its own history and spiritual basis, and there is simply the reading. We could spend our whole lives reading cards. What pleasure :)

I wish people would start reading with their Marseilles, calling for Querents in the Reading Exchange and posting their own readings in Your Readings. THat is how I learned and am still learning. Possibly people have other outlets for reading practice?

Aeclectic is a learning community, and a really wonderful one. What is a mistake? And does it matter anyway. I don't know anyone else here who has mistaken a Baton for Sword in the Marseille.......but I did. :). That would have to be a fairly significant mistake. No......people were so gracious. And now I know.